nevertheless........bhop was way past his prime... you cannot deny that..... kessler wasent near his best due to his injury (he didnt use his right hand after round 6)...... and lacy....are you serious
I think your comfusing pfp fighter with the pfp slapper list. No one thinks joe is best fighter in the world other than his nut huggers
Why is everyone getting all riled up everytime someone puts up a p4p list.. any ****in fan with one eye towards boxing knows its manny at #1 and Joe at #2. Stop using the p4p list as a red herring to hate on fighters
Well said:good I think it is pretty cut and dried: 1 - Manny . . . . . 2 - Joe C . . . . . 3 - Whoever (?)
Very few have him at number one. But your criticism is seriously flawed. Kessler clearly didnt hold back with his right hand in their fight. Yes it was injured in training which curtailed his sparring but its not like joes can let his hands go is it? Joe tried to fight Hopkins years back, he agreed then came back asking for double. Hopkins dodged him then, probably due to the percieved risk relative to the reward, but dodge he did. There was never enough money to get Jones in a ring with Joe.. Joe just wasnt on his radar while people like Hopkins dodged him he never would be. Mitchell a semi fighter?? What the ****? 2 time world champ that had never been put down or stopped a semi fighter? There are some weak names on Joe's list, Mitchell aint one of them. When he fought Joe he should have legitimately been the WBA and IBF champ had he not been robbed in Germany. Veit, though never great, was a 30-0 mandatory. Every long term champ must face guys like that.
Ringini is a crack head or a hater. Thats my profesional opinion. Its the same problem with a lot of guys on the site. Dude P4P lists are subjective but within strict parameters so there is leeway but only a small amount. I think as so many have already said, that most boxing fans being only halfway objective, will have Manny at number 1 and Joe at number 2. To have them the otherway around is more than possible but in a way is down to your interpretation of what P4P means. Dont take it personally dude and hen use it as an excuse to hate.
I think he's referring to the ******ed P4P list on the ESb front page that has Joe at #1, Oscar at #8, Haye at #9 and Hopkins at #10. :rofl
Frankly I was amazed when Joe's miserable performance against BHop moved him up the p4p list. It just shows how subjective such lists really are. For the died in the wool, hardcore slappy joe haters like me, October and November will be awesome months! By the time Pavlik and Taylor get done with BHop and Lacy, Joe's "legacy" will be in tatters:happy
Yea, this one off the front page... " Top Ten Pound 4 Pound Fighters Today 31.07.08 - by John Carter: Pound 4 Pound lists are always a very emotive and subjective collection of names. Everyone seems to have (and rightly so) not only an opinion of who should be on the list but also a different definition of what P4P actually means. For example, in my opinion Joe Calzaghe fits the criteria perfectly while Ricky Hatton, does not. The description of “pound 4 pound “ goes back really to the days of Sugar Ray Robinson, when while he was clearly thee best fighter in his division he could never be expected to defeat a heavyweight. However, his supporters argued that with his skills applied to any of the weight categories, he would indeed be able to beat all those above and below him in weight when all things are considered. Level of opposition of course must also be taken into account. Since Antonio Margarito’s stunning “walk down” defeat of Miguel Cotto and thus creating movement in those rankings I have rated below, in my opinion, who today’s best P4P fighters are. 1)Joe Calzaghe, 45-0. A consummate all-rounder who possesses blinding hand speed, a great chin and a high calibre of overall ring generalship. All things considered Joe deserves his place as ‘numero uno’ 2)Manny Pacquiao, 47-3-2. All action. What’s not to like about Manny Pacquiao? A multiple weight world champion proves he has the minerals to be high on this list. Many may argue that he should be number one, however, I wont argue against that he is thee most exciting fighter today but exciting and P4P are not the same. His all round ‘game’ doesn’t quite measure up to Joe C. 3)Kelly Pavlik, 34-0. Another all action fighter who possesses ALL the fundamental techniques to carry him even higher up these rankings. A win over Joe Calzaghe if the fight should ever happen would probably propel KP to number 1. 4)Israel Vasquez, 43-4. A firm fans favourite who has a vice-like grip on the WBC super bantamweight belt. Stunning fights with Rafael Marquez have proved that he has the silky skills and awesome left hook to worry any fighter at any weight. 5)Antonio Margarito, 37-5. Anyone who still had doubts about the Tijuana Tornado surely must have abandoned those by now. His stunning “walk down” of Miguel Cotto emphatically moves Margo up this list. No fighter in any division would be totally safe from the blue collar, iron chinned man from Mexico. A win over Williams could move him higher still. 6)Juan Manuel Marquez, 48-4-1. A canny operator who despite on the wrong end of decisions to Pacquiao, he remains a very shrewd operator in the ring. He has at times made Pacquiao look amateurish at best but his all round boxing skills cannot be questioned. He is firmly in the middle of these rankings. 7)Miguel Cotto, 32-1. Make no mistake, despite his late rounds beat down at the hands of Margo, Junito will be back, he is too good a fighter not too. In the early rounds he showed excellent technique against the much bigger man. He is unfortunate that his division has two much larger fighters in Antonio Margarito and Paul Williams. Too big now for 140lbs, he may hope that Margo and Williams also go up a division. Miguel Cotto is far from finished.. 8)Oscar De La Hoya, 39-5-1. Pushed Floyd very close when they met and actually ‘won’ in the eyes of some but wasn’t as impressive last time out against Steve Forbes. De La Hoya’s credentials however cannot be denied. A champion from super-featherweight to middleweight, he is unquestionably a championship P4P veteran. A win over Pacquiao won’t elevate him anywhere on this list but a verdict over someone like Margo would see his ranking go a lot higher. 9)David Haye, 21-1. No doubt a controversial choice but David Haye is a VERY good boxer who will climb a lot higher in the years to come. Untested against a true heavyweight ( Bonin doesn’t count ) we should see if Haye justifies inclusion in this list. David Haye has ALL the tools IMO to firmly plant his feet and remain here. 10) Bernard Hopkins, 48-5-1 Still deserves a mention and about to climb into the lions den and a meeting with KP. A shock decision over Kelly Pavlik and ‘Nard might go higher but in truth his place in the top ten is under serious threat. "
This guy has Joe no.1 too, a writer from the Star Ledger newpaper in the US.... Calzaghe tops Star-Ledger pound-for-pound list This content is protected Posted by This content is protected July 31, 2008 11:57AM Categories: This content is protected BY FRANKLIN McNEIL Star-Ledger staff Here is The Star-Ledger's most recent boxing pound-for-pound list: 1. Joe Calzaghe 2. Manny Pacquiao 3. Juan Manuel Marquez 4. Kelly Pavlik 5. Israel Vazquez 6. Antonio Margarito 7. Rafael Marquez 8. Ivan Calderon 9. Miguel Cotto 10. Chris John Franklin McNeil covers boxing and mixed martial arts for The Star-Ledger. This content is protected
Joe can't be considered #1 due to the work Manny Paq has done recently against higher P4P competition. Joe is a very deserving #2 at the moment in my view and if he beat Pavlik, Jones Jr and say Chad Dawson, he'd be #1.
I just laugh at this ****. How many in this place has Joe #1 in the p4p list anyway ??? Half of the posters that critisize Joe, hasn´t been around long enough to value Joe´s opponents, or they may live in a place where they are nobodys. That doesn´t count for ****. P4P and hall of fame is ALL UTTER BULL****.....it´s all subjective and not measureable. And I laugh at those who thinks that Pavlik would beat Joe.... All of you that have Pavlik in your P4P top five, should at least have Joe # 2. Joe would school Pavlik even at this stage of his career.
The P4P system has been misinterpreted. Constantly. P4P Calzaghe doesn't beat a ****load of guys in the top 20. Alot of people don't even think he could beat Chad Dawson. Kessler, now there is a one dimensional fighter. He's a one handed, one dimensional fighter, LOL.
It's fair enough to have Joe at #2 now, but if Marquez beats Casamayor to become a three-weight world champ, while Joe beats up an over-the-hill (not my words, Joe Calzaghe's- see his autobiography) washed-up RJJ for cash, JMM must legitimately go above him.