How Close To Unbeatable Was FOTC Frazier?

I honestly don't know what is Ali's peak. I think he would have peaked about 68 or 69 if he wasn't exiled from the sport.

1960's Ali was quicker, had better footwork and faster hands than the 1970's Ali. I believe 1970's Ali took a better punch, probably because he had to find out the hard way that he could and he was stronger overall as a puncher.

Correct me if I'm wrong, probably just my opinion alone, but I think Ali absorbed a lot harder punchers than the hook that Cooper took him down with. Foreman never landed the same clean uppercut shot against Ali that he did to Frazier and Norton, so we'll never truly know the strength of Ali's chin. Shavers hit him with a good right hand, as did Norton to the body, but 1960's Ali doesn't strike me as a fighter that took serious bombs, except a couple shots from Liston when he was half blind.

 

I don't, and have never professed Frazier to be at his absolute peak condition, neither physically nor medically against Foreman. From what you have said on multiple occasions however, it reads as though the man was totally shot and that if he wasn't, he would have completely turned the tables from getting clobbered over two rounds to rising victorious. This is flawed logic. While Frazier may have indeed been slipping, he was perhaps only 9 lbs over his best fight weight, 29 years of age, the reigning heavyweight champion, and less than two years removed from his best performance. Additonally, he would fight in a few other signature efforts following his loss to Foreman.

CONCLUSION - It is reasonable to say that Frazier was " slipping " a tad in his 1973 loss to Foreman. It is NOT reasonable however, to say that he was " totally past it ", " physically disabled ", or " medically impaired " and that he would have given Foreman a battle of epic proportions or even won, if he hadn't been......

Frazier lost to another all time great who simply had his number both physically and stylistically...... Deal with it...

 

Right on the money. The truth is tough pill sometimes.

 

well round 15 - his peak was against williams and terrell - he wasn't fighting in 1968 or 69. his peak wasn't against bonavena or frazier. cus d'mato didn't think he would beat quarry cuz of the lay-off.

 

This is an excellent post with well argued points imo.:good I wish I had written it .

 

A 1966/67 Ali would have beaten him. Along with Liston,Foreman and probably Louis. Anyone else would have been hard pushed to do so. Holmes would have a 50/50 shot.

 

Seems about right.

 

Thank you my friend. :good

 

put him with tua and see him KO'd.
put him with tyson and see him lose.
put him with marciano and get a close violent great fight.
put him with someone big enough and see him TKO'd like with foreman - either the klitschkos or even foreman himslef was enough.
maybe lewis wouldn't have stopped him.
byrd was problematic as we know , tua can tell you about it.
holyfield also a problem , maybe even Qawi.