How did Ray Robinson navigate such a gifted path as a pro ?

Very true. I was just saying "WW champion" for the sake of simplicity, but you're quite right in that he was himself struggling to get a title shot at WW during most of this time. By the time he finally got his shot at the WW title C Kid and Williams were already fading out of contention for the MW title.

 

A champion is obligated to fight his top contenders and thus Zale absolutely can be criticized for not fighting Burley, it tarnishes his legacy.

 

Zero calls for him fighting them is a pretty strong argument, I think we can be certain that the fight would have interested many people. As far as promoters making fights thats ridiculous, LaMotta could have demanded his promoter make the fight and it would have happened.

 

Also, I find it rather suspicious that Holman Williams was suddenly able to get fights with top white fighters like Cerdan and LaMotta in 1946 when he was past his prime. This would seem to shoot down the idea that lack of public interest prevented the fight from happening.

 

When he faced Cerdan he had lost to Lytell, but otherwise no clear indication of a slide as far as I know. The loss to Cerdan seems to have been close and a fight that perhaps could have had a different outcome if Williams had been the home fighter, so it's difficult to say if that was seen as an indication that he was getting past it. But, yeah, if LaMotta had beaten him before Lytell did, it would have looked better.

 

Yeah, I don't think "not enough money" is a viable excuse for a champion not to face his top contenders. If you have the crown you should defend against the best out there. If you don't want to do that, you should relinquish it.

Imagine letting Real Madrid, CL champions, choose to defend their title against Manchester United just because they're the best risk/reward, instead of going the hard route like everyone else? It would be a travesty. No one would stand for it. Just like no one should stand for a world champion in boxing skipping on the most dangerous challengers in order to get the best risk/reward ones.

 

Joey Giardello is perhaps the best example of a fighter who fought virtually all his best contemporaries. He faced many of the other most dangerous contenders while he was a contender himself and under no obligation to face them-guys like Spider Webb, George Benton, Joey Giambra, etc. Many of these guys he could have easily ducked but he faced them anyway.

 

Yeah, but he is a Philly boy...we roll correctly and are made of harder stuff.

 

Archie Moore never fought Sugar Ray Robinson, Joe Louis, Ken Overlin, Jersey Joe Walcott, Ceferino Garcia, Jake LaMotta, Kid Tunero, Dave Sands, Artie Levine, Anton Christoforidis, Jose Basora, Fred Apostoli, Billy Conn, Billy Soose, Melio Bettina... Was he ducking them?

 

Thank you. Grants argument is not only bull**** but historically inaccuratue, contextually speaking.

 

Joey Giardello faced
Richard Tiger
Rubin Carter
Juan Carlos Rivero
Sugar Ray Robinson
George Benton
Henry Hank
Joe DeNucci
Terry Downes
Gene Fullmer
Holly Mims
Spider Webb
Ralph Jones
Joey Giambra
Rory Calhoun
Charley Cotton
Pierre Langlois
Johnny Saxton
Gil Turner
Billy Graham
Rocky Castellani

What's more impressive is he wasn't a defending champion for virtually all these fights and thus not obligated to face these guys.

 

Black middleweight fighters such as Eddie Booker, Aaron Wade, Lloyd Marshall, Archie Moore, Charley Burley and Jack Chase had quite a few fights in California during the period from 1940 to 1947. At the time in California, $15,000. would be a terrific gate for any bout featuring any of the mentioned fighters. Under the circumstances, both Jake LaMotta and Sugar Ray Robinson were not going to come out to California for bouts when they were drawing far larger gates in New York City, Chicago, Detroit or Pittsburgh.

- Chuck Johnston

 

LaMotta did fight Lloyd Marshall