How do you define ducking?

Illegal IV on the eve of the fight, questionable injections for the relief of hand pain..??...Floyd was str8 up scared to fight Pac.

Timed him out, at least 5 years too late, including Floyd only fighting Manny after someone else had KO’d the Pac-Man - enough to convince PBF to finally step into the ring against Manny - even then, Floyd looked scared for the first few rounds.

 

My programming forbids me from answering that question.

 

Freddie Roach: When they were both in their prime, two years ago, I'm sure they both wanted to make that fight happen.

Freddie Roach: Because the first negotiation, we were against the blood tests and it was kind of our fault that first time when it didn't work.

Mayweather apparently waited for Pacquiao to be KO'd by a guy he handled worse than any man ever did already, and did it very, very, very, very easily. A guy who'd already handled Pacquiao. I don't think this was a concern but maybe Floyd entered the ring very scared against Manny, before out-throwing and out-landing him (which he did). But we already know from Pac's own camp who walked away from negotiations when they mattered the most. That's publicly available stuff. We've always known. It's just hard for most people to accept. I mean, they made commercials about Floyd ducking Manny later, despite everyone who wanted to know already knowing that this was the opposite of reality, in a completely verifiable way.

 

At least 5 years and a KO loss too late. Like Floyd wasn’t known for his cherry picking and timing otherwise? Okay....

How about dat illegal IV and unapproved pain relief injections?

 

How about changing the subject from the fact that you are literally stating the opposite of reality, as in the case of the dog record holder? Changing history to make it suit a narrative that you prefer? "The knuckle, swollen to the size of a goose egg, had been broken in a previous fight and further bruised in training. ...Mayweather needed more than Novocain..."

This is completely, completely medical. But none of that matters if we can't even agree with Pac's own trainer that Pacquiao ducked Mayweather when it mattered most and not the literal opposite. Bobi was a god. Now pain relief is the point? I thought we were talking about who ducked who and in that point you simply lost and have nothing left but but to change the subject and see if you can make me hop on my other foot fast enough that I don't know I'm dancing and singing for my supper. Sad. Just like you want to change history to make it Mayweather who ducked Pacquiao, you wanted to make Bobi not the record-holder. Maybe you need to ask yourself what you are doing with your time and start being part of the solution. And not the solution that was in those protein shakes Ariza used to make Manny that he wouldn't tell Freddie what was in them during that totally coincidental time he refused stricter drug testing and ducked Mayweather over it when it could've turned him into the greatest fighter since Ray Robinson.

 

I don't think Duran ducked McCallum. Mike was not well known then and Hearns was and that was a natural fight. Hearns had fought Ray and Benitez and Duran had also fought them, so it was just another natural matchup. Duran could make more money which is the bottomline in boxing. Had Duran beaten Hearns it would have been a huge feather in his cap. Had he beaten Mike then they would have said Mike was not ready for him. I really don't think fighters duck too often. This is too tough a sport for guys to duck someone. If they were into ducking fighters they would not have become fighters in the first place. Canelo to me is not ducking Benavidez. If anything he knows he has done a lot in boxing and why have a tough fight for no good reason. Benavidez has proved he deserves a fight with Canelo? How? He is a good undefeated fighter, but he has other guys to fight. He can move up the ranks and fight top guys and if he really can beat someone as great as Alvarez he will still be undefeated or dominant after a few more fights, and the fight will be more natural with Canelo or anyone else. F;oyd vs. Manny? That was more of a waiting for the right time for Floyd to dominate a diminishing Manny. I wouldn't call it a duck. That was typical Floyd. Fight guys at the right time for an undefeated record.

 

You’ve moved from the Quacking Duck Floyd to Bobi, the All Bark But No Bite dog.

Is this being sung to the tune of Old McDonald’s Farm, E-I-E-I-O? I’m waiting for the introduction of the Pig.

Bobi is/was not the worlds oldest dog. Look it up. Read it and weep if you must.

That’s a reality that you still can’t accept and are still trying to change in all delusion .....projection is a thing, you know.

So you’re still backing the false claims, made on behalf of Bobi, claims that were completely debunked.

Get a grip man, they used photos of a completely different younger dog to falsify their claims.

Gobi was not a God. You have it ass up, Gobi was just a Dog. Sit Gobi, sit. Good Dog.

A Dog who actually wasn’t the oldest Dog on record.

You’re living in La La Land - and, btw, that didn’t actually win Best Picture either, - a preemptive strike in case you want to argue over that obvious fact too.

That you’re also trying to defend Mayweather’s avoidance of prime PAC absolutely figures.

PAC has never been accused of ducking, cherry picking nor framing for the “right” time to face certain opponents.

On the other hand, Floyd has been thusly accused, and rightfully so.

In terms of intestinal fortitude and the propensity to take on actual challenges, there’s no logic that doesn’t place PAC head and shoulders above Mayweather.

Manny is the Man. Floyd is the Mouse.

Features such as illegal IVs, illegal pain killers are very much part of the subject also. Floyd, the proverbial Pot trying to call the Kettle Black.

These are simply valid reference points that you personally don’t like.

Points that extend upon your own shallow treatment in your biased attempt to defend Floyd. Points that clearly impugn your position.

That was fun. We should do this more often Boxed.

 

Ducking is such a loaded term that we need to put it in context. I can see a fighter going for the big money against an opponent. Think in terms of Tony Zale going against Rocky Graziano and Bobby Chacon against Boza Edwards. In the case of Zale, his team avoided the fighters that had earned their place and had been ignored in lieu of Graziano. I can actually see it. Zale hadn't made a dime in 4 years in the service and wanted to cash in. Choosing Mr. Boxoffice was going to put coin in his pocket and the fact that it was a trilogy made it more substantial. I'm sure some of the other contenders didn't like it, but again, I see it. Also, Chacon was supposed to fight Don King's boy Hector Camacho for $250,000, but then opted to defend against his #1 contender Boza Edwards for $450,000. I see it and who would object? Well, the Don King backed WBC for one, who stripped Chacon of the title. These are just 2 examples where money talked. So let's move on.

I have a hard time saying so and so ducked his opponent. We don't know how much impact the fighter's choices have when selecting an opponent. So lets just say it's the fighters team that makes that call and we'll blame the manager. Here are a few examples:

The Floyd Patterson one has been well researched here. And it is clear Cus ducked so many of Floyd's top contenders (Folley, Mcahen, Valdes, Williams and Liston) before Floyd grabbed the bull by the horns. That act alone shows these fighters would engage, but when you have a cautious manager, things happen, or in this case, don't happen.

We've gone over this ad nauseum about Marciano's defenses. But again, I blame Al Weill for skirting around Nino Valdes and Bob Baker while going for the woeful Don Cockell. I had read an interesting article of when that fight was signed how Weill had a group of boxing writers packed together when he announced Cockell as the next opponent and the writer stated that Weill, unashamedly, tried to convince the writers that they were taking on something big by exclaiming, "Hey, this guy's a killer!" The writer said, we all fell to the ground laughing. I would call this instance a duck, but not like some who might name several of Rocky's opponents. Just this one opponent IMO that was undeserving and should have been at least Valdes or Baker. The rest were deserving.

Gus Lesnevich's manager Lew Diamond made no bones about the fact that Jimmy Bivins had no hope of challenging for Gus' title. This, after Bivins had just outclassed world champ Gus in a non-title. And despite the NBA trying to push this, Lew kept to his word and never let Bivins within arms-length. Acknowledging that Gus was about to go into the service, Diamond made it clear beforehand. A complete duck.

The aforementioned Tony Zale, although I recognise the point about making a buck, what was up with a defense against Steve Mamakos instead of some of his heartier middleweights like Ken Overlin, Archie Moore and Steve Belloise? For one, Mamakos wasn't a middleweight, he was a welter and more of a clubfighter at that. Zale beats him in a non-title, decks him twice and he gets a title shot? With a record of 1-3-1 in his last 5 fights. Man, I don't know if you just want to call that cherry-picking.

Henry Armstrong. Yes, that Henry Armstrong. Although putting it on the line in an amazing 20 title defenses, I count only 4 that were deserving. Normally, because of his activity i wouldn't say anything, but the fact remains, while he was defending against some really well-chewed fighters, Holman, Williams, Charley Burley, Jimmy Leto and Cocoa Kid were all in the top ten. Henry's manager was Eddie Mead and he must've been one cautious dude when you look at the stats of Henry's defenses. Hate to say it, but a solid duck.

Sandro Lopopollo avoided Jose Napoles like the plague. Napoles was the #1 contender for most of the 4 years he was in the 140 lb ratings. Now you could spread the wealth a bit that maybe Carlos Hernandez could have stepped up, and you'd be right, but Lopopollo had an edict from the WBA (I believe) and he came up with every excuse including saying he was an accident (much like Wilfred Benitez with the proposed Antonio Cervantes rematch, which cost him his title). Anyways, Napoles got bored with the runaround and moved up to 147. But both ducks.

I'm long-winded today, but that's my take on it.

 

I have Morrissey on, by candle light, cutting myself. How is that fun? I've been doing this since the conversation started. That's it, I'm going to hospital. I'll be back later, guys. smh

 

They made a mess of it close they waited 5 or 6 years too late to make the fight.

 

Actually I fault Fairweather and Pedsquiao for killing a lot of my interest for current boxing.
They took so dang long to finally make the dang fight happen that my interest dried out.
On top of that, the fight was a stinker for the ages. However, I realized I was not really upset, I simply didn't care anymore, and it has been like that since then.

 

That is far too dark man. Open those blinds up, put some Bucks Fizz or Brotherhood of Man on. Slay that Black Dog. We’re a family here, all for one and one for all.