How does the Classic Forum Rate Pacquiao in an all-time P4P sense?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Rumsfeld, Nov 15, 2009.

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  1. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    I personally don't think it's fair to rate him until his career is finished, but what Pacquiao has done (since six years ago to the day) is simply AMAZING!

    Jenna and I discussed this on our post fight radio show.

    My feeling is that he is NOT top 10 (for sure).

    I came up with a figure of 25-35 off the top of my head, but I didn't have time to really think about it much.

    I've given this more thought since the show.

    I'm curious where you guys would rate him. Please give reasons for why you'd place him where you do.

    The debate that inspired this poll can be heard by CLICKING HERE for anyone who was interested.

    I am looking forward to seeing your replies and reasoning.
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 15, 2009
    #1
  2. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He is getting up there, and maybe the #2 all time Filipino on this morning's performance. I would still put him behind Villa, but even if he were to lose every fight from now on, in a pound for pound sense he probably is better than Elorde.

    So that makes him a top 80 all-time fighter.
     
    TBooze, Nov 15, 2009
    #2
  3. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    One of the points I was trying to make on the show (which I'm not sure if I was clear on) is that "Pound for Pound is a mythical title that presupposes how fighters from different weight classes would fare against one another "if they were the same size".

    A lot of people, I think, get stuck in this mindset that moving up and winning belts in multiple weight classes makes you a great P4P fighter. This is true, and this is one element that I consider, but there are other elements, too.

    Someone like Hagler was in the same division for years, and in the eyes of some, I think they downplay his status in a P4P sense because of it, but that should not be the case.

    Then there are head-to-head possibilities, and in your own way, you need to go through a round robin scenario in your head with all of the greats. This is a most daunting task!

    Evaluating these sorts of things is not easy. There is no universally agreed upon criteria and things are thrown a miss by individual bias and personal preference.

    What Pacquiao has accomplished HAS BEEN amazing.

    I appreciate what I have been witnesses and think I will appreciate it even more with time.
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 15, 2009
    #3
  4. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes, ultimately all time pound for pound ratings are absolutely ridiculous. How can you seriously rate a 105lbs man from 1867 against a 400lbs man from 2009 with everyone in between?
     
    TBooze, Nov 15, 2009
    #4
  5. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

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    He definitely deserves to rub shoulders with some who are often ranked between 20-30, 30-40 like Griffith, Chavez, etc.
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Nov 15, 2009
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  6. Topdawg

    Topdawg New Member Full Member

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    Why not rank him by achievements?
     
    Topdawg, Nov 15, 2009
    #6
  7. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I will wait until he retires ,but he is now an undeniably an all time great.
    Just watched the fight I had him up 8 rds to 3 before the stoppage ,and thought the referee could have stopped it around the 9th or 10th.

    Cotto showed great heart and guts, and when he boxed behind his jab looked solid, but when he could not wobble Manny with his shots ,and in turn sufferd knockdowns ,the writing was on the wall.
    I am doing well at the moment with my forecasts I picked Vitali ,,Haye, and Pac man.
     
    mcvey, Nov 15, 2009
    #7
  8. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

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    Some of them would...if he fought in black and white. Or, better still, if there was no footage available of him.
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Nov 15, 2009
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  9. Topdawg

    Topdawg New Member Full Member

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    He would have been immortalized had he been from the early 1900s;)

    In a H2H sense, though, I believe that only those we are very great technicians and counter-punchers can convincingly beat him.

    Joe Gan vs Pacman, anyone?
     
    Topdawg, Nov 15, 2009
    #9
  10. flamengo

    flamengo Coool as a Cucumber. Full Member

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    :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl


    Great comment!! Still feel pretty fortunate in watching this dynano. He's definately one of the more unique fighters.
     
    flamengo, Nov 15, 2009
    #10
  11. flamengo

    flamengo Coool as a Cucumber. Full Member

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    Please don't start with these lame arsed comparisons.. Gans vs Pacquiao at L/W.. Gans might be fortunate to see the second round. I doubt that even!!
     
    flamengo, Nov 15, 2009
    #11
  12. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    :lol:
     
    JohnThomas1, Nov 15, 2009
    #12
  13. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Well, if that was the case some on this board would probably feel he'd have an outside chance of KO'ing Haye.:smoke
     
    Bokaj, Nov 15, 2009
    #13
  14. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Wall space at the hall of fame has already been reserved. I'm not a big fan of pound for pound rankings, but I do think Pacquiao has moved into the top 20 of all time. If he beats Mayewather, a top 15 spot can be earned.
     
    Mendoza, Nov 15, 2009
    #14
  15. teeto

    teeto Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    Don't know where he ranks, but he stands with the greatest fighters of all time for me, whatever that means. There's so many ways that you can detract from wins, but no, you can do that with anyone if you start over analysing weaknesses of their opponents
     
    teeto, Nov 15, 2009
    #15
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