How does Tony Zale do against the murderers row?

I posted the middleweight rankings 1944-1946


Graziano did not defeat any top 10 men at 160....

You argued earlier graziano May have been number 1 when he took on zale. How could that possibly be without a single victory over any middleweight in the top 10?

 

Lesnevich was scared to death of Charles and Moore 1946-1948..no way was he going to give either of them a title shot

He had two choices

1. Fight one of his two top contenders Moore and Charles and lose easily

2. Avoid both of them and take on a lower rated soft fighter who drew well

He went with choice number 2.

May be a smart business move, but we can’t possibly give Lesnevich any credit as a champion. A champion should fight the best in his divison and Lesnevich failed in the regard emphatically

 

Considering Charles may have been avoided worse than any man in history from 1946-1948, and cleaned out a stacked 175lb divison besides the paper champion whom refused to fight him.....did it matter who he fought up a divison?

He was a natural light heavyweight who should have been a long reigning light heavyweight champion...instead he was avoided for years, so he was forced to move up and defeat a 6’2 218lb champion who hadn’t lost in 14 years...

Charles beat prime ATGs in three different divisions....Burley 160, Moore 175, and Walcott heavyweight...

How many other fighters in history did that?

If you want to criticize him for one missing out on anyone during his title reign it was Layne...who beat Walcott. But Laynes manager was an idiot who signed to fight Marciano rather than sit on the big win.

“Thompson”

Lost a title eliminator to Valentino

Also lost to Bivins in 48 whom Charles beat twice that year

 

So once again, we’ve established graziano did not beat a single top 10 ranked middleweight contender from 1944-1946.....Burley defeated Seven. SEVEN!

Yet you think defeating a “welterweight champion” who weighed in at 142 qualifies as some sort of important middleweight win?

Ranked contenders at 160 defeated - graziano 0. Burley 7

 

In history I have never heard of a man being rated number 1 in a divison where he hadn’t beaten a single top 10 contender in that same divison

 

In Charles book, it hints that Charles wanted to beat up Lesnevich for ducking him all those years...it was personal for Ezz

I believe Bivins deserved a title shot entering 1946...as the undefeated interim heavyweight duration champion the past 3 years. Bivins also deserved a title shot at 175 for sure....he beat Lesnevich so badly Lesnevich refused to fight him again

Bivins and Thompson were more qualified opponents than barone and Beshore...so sure

 

The problem with Arcels quote is he essentially lets Dempsey off the hook from fighting him by saying “he would have killed him”.

Had arcel said “Dempsey definitely should have fought him, wills earned his title shot, but I still think Dempsey would have killed him”...

That’s a much more reasonable and realistic quote that doesn’t sound emotional and bias

 

Lesnevichs ducking began before WW II


"Jimmy Bivins, hard-punching Cleveland negro, saw his hopes of a light-heavyweight title match with Gus Lesnevich fade today despite - or perhaps because of - the decisive whipping he gave the champion in a non-title 10 round bout last night. Despite the NBA edict that Bivins be given a title match "within 60 days" if he should win, Lew Diamond, manager of Lesnevich, effectively spiked any future bout. Bivins battered Lesnevich into the ropes with a heavy right in the 1st round - a punch acknowledged by Gus to have slowed him throughout the fight. Bivins dumped Lesnevich on the seat of his trunks in the 2nd round, but the champion got up before a count and successfully evaded Bivins' attempts to land a knockout punch." -United Press

• Unofficial UP scorecard - 7-2-1 Bivins

Post fight comment

• " There isn't a chance of Lesnevich fighting Bivins again." -Lew Diamond, Lesnevich's manage

 

Wrong...the first article states NBA rated Burley the most outstanding contender. The NBA had a lot more credibility than the New York Ring.....


You’re gonna nitpick Lamotta not fighting Burley in 46 yet he had already fought Marshall, Williams, and Lytell....3 fighters Graziano wouldn’t dream of facing?


“Fighting the welterweight champions”

Except Lamotta fought the BEST welterweight champion and also 3 top middleweights of the black murderers row.

What black murderers row member did graziano take on?

Better yet, name me a ranked middleweight graziano beat 1944-1946?

 

Charles fought Lesnevich in 1949 to give him a beating for ducking him all those years