How does Tony Zale do against the murderers row?

what the hell is murderer's row?

 

Black contenders.

 

"Kid Tunero"

Tunero got two title fights against Marcel Thil and lost them both.

Tunero raises an interesting question. How good were the Americans (white or black) versus the Euros in the 1930's,

Tunero was in his twenties campaigning in Europe in the 1930's. His record is pretty spotty, with losses to

Marcel Thil (2)
Gustav Roth
Carmelo Candel (2)
Jock McAvoy (KO defeat)
Vilda Jaks (2)
Gustav Eder
Eduard Tenet
Bep Kleveren (2)

Coming to the US in the 1940's in his thirties, Tunero runs up an imposing record, with victories over

Ken Overlin
Jose Basora
Ezzard Charles
Holman Williams

Somewhat the same thing happens with Anton Christoforidis. He had failed to beat Eduard Tenet in three tries, with two losses and a draw. He also lost to Bep Kleveren. In the US, though, he wins his way to the light-heavy title with back to back victories over Jimmy Bivins and Melio Bettina.

So two fighters who lost to Tenet and Kleveren run up wins over Ezzard Charles, Jimmy Bivins, Holman Williams, Melio Bettina, and Jose Basora.

I judge it at least fair to ask if perhaps the gap between American and Euro fighters in the 1930's was not as wide as Americans assume. There isn't really that many head to heads to evaluate.

WWII would obviously, I think, set boxing back much more in Europe than in America.

 

"McAvoy wasn't rated when Mills beat him"

McAvoy was rated #4 in the 1939 ratings. He had been rated every year since 1935. He won two fights in 1940 before losing to Mills in August of 1940. Why wouldn't he have been rated?

I think Mills deserved his first shot in May, of 1946, especially as he had actually eliminated Harvey as a title claimant, and Mills had a win over everyone he had fought since 1940.

Charles lost badly twice in 1943 and then went in the army. He was not a contender in May 1946 at all.

the problem with the ratings is that they were by an American magazine and are American centered. How did the British look at Mills as a challenger in 1946?

I hesitated to enter this fray because of the apparent bad feeling, but I hope we can have a stable discussion of Mills.

 

Over the long run, but prior to WWII?

Zale lost to Soose. Okay. Soose lost to Burley and Bivins. He also lost 3 times to Abrams. But Soose beat Overlin twice, and Overlin won and drew in two fights with Charles. Charles beat Burley twice, but lost to Tunero, and Tunero also beat Williams and Basora. But Tunero lost to one Joe Sutka. Joe Sutka lost to Abrams, and Abrams lost to Zale.

This is a chain of back and forths. A beat B and B beat C and C beat D and D beats B and C beats A., etc. Frankly, we can go into it, but I don't see anyone standing out before the war, so I don't see much of a criticism of Zale's pre-war record.

After the war, he obviously went for the big money fights with Graziano. Just a question. Graziano was rated #4 that year in the end of the year ratings. But where exactly was he rated going into the 1946 Zale fight?

 

Because he wasn't.

 

FFS
Mills beat him in42 ;how is that relevant to his title chances in46?

 

Blah blah blah!

 

Mills beat McAvoy twice, in 1940 and 1942.

 

what light-heavyweight had beaten Mills in the interim.

 

Show me the ratings for July, 1940 which prove McAvoy had dropped out of the ratings.

 

This seems childish. Why not have a sensible debate?

 

Absolutely correct.

This seems to be rather overlooked dosnt it?

Exactly, and the promotion of Mills vs Lesnevich fight would be one of the biggest professional sporting events that could be made that year.

 

There is nothing to criticise before the war. After the war the biggest fights that could be made were made first. I think that’s how things have always been. Mostly that’s a good thing isn’t it?

 

It might not be "right" by some people's lights, but it is very understandable that Zale, after losing four years of prime earning potential to military service, would sign to fight a highly ranked contender who was so popular that the fight with Graziano outdrew the Joe Louis title defense at the same venue that same month.