How good really was Marciano?

we can all see through your bull****.

 

Underrated, total overachiever. Watch his clips. Watch the one some guy made about his underrated defense. Gave Ali fits in that staged fight, read they actually threw some leather.

 

Good fighter but overrated unfortunately. Rock fought in the 50s and when most (all) "white" fighters didn't meet up with the toughest bros unless they were 35+ or so (baseball hadn't broke the color barrier until the late 40s). Charles, Walcott and Louis were all on the downside and near the end of their careers (Charles was only about 33 but had already fought a million wars against other tough bros). The heavyweights of the era were smaller so I think he only fought a couple guys above 200 lbs (one being JL). He was considered the best (sort of like Calzaghe on ESB) but actually never had to fight a prime fighter of color for obvious reasons.
Rock was the arguably the greatest "white" heavyweight (more or less). I was a kid in the 60s and my pop was into boxing so I was heavily exposed to Rock. As a sign of the times, Ali (Clay) wasn't accorded the legendary status he has today as the whole racial thing was very, very potent. Only begrudgingly, over a long period, did Ali receive the credit for his obvious and ample talent.

No disrespect to Rock - dig watching him fight.

 

Prime Mike Tyson was a little on the smallish size. 5'11", short arms, he still did ok till he lost sight of what got him there.

 

rocky had the heart and will to win at all costs that's what made him great. the man could not quit. great champion just came at a low point in top heavy's

 

May not be a great argument, but that is one major reason I give Mike a lot of credit. I'm sympathetic to heavyweights who excelled without the optimal height and length of their peers. For example, I'll admit that Lennox had the better overall career and even was the better fighter or talent. But, who wouldn't rather be 6'5" 245 than Mike's size? Similarly, I'm more critical if you're half a foot taller than your opponents and/or outweight them by a material amount. Anyone ever seen what happens when a huge defensive end or offensive tackle gets in a row with a 6'0 or 6'1" 220 running back in the locker room? When there is no room to maneuver the size advantage is more than daunting. Or can anyone imagine Derek Fisher (guard) getting in a fistfight with Shaq (center)? Pretty ludicrous. Hard to give the bigger guy all that much credit for his "victory" when it is more attributable to size disparity than skill in the ring. That said, the most skilled big man in the recent era is LL.

 

In an era where rankings do really mean something and that the best do fight all the comers, I guess he is really impressive. His resume speaks for itself.

 

He did well during his time, although in almost all of his big wins, he struggled on the way to victory. He's got one of the (if not the) biggest heart in boxing ever.

But head to head, I give him very small chance against Ali, Foreman, Tyson, Lewis. IMO Ali UDs him wide whereas the other 3 KOs him inside 6.

Rocky against Frazier and Rocky against Holyfield would be one for the ages, although IMO Frazier and Holyfield KOs him late.

 

Walcott, Louis.

Nobody smaller or at the same weight as Marciano beats him - the only one who could do it would be Sam Langford. Some bigger man may beat him but even that´s not sure.
Marciano had great power, workrate, chin, a very good and underrated defence, great bodywork, punches from every angle, great determination and pressure physicaly and mentally very few fighters in the history of the sport ever were able to produce.
Definitly one of the greatest hws ever and also a great p4p fighter. I´m not a fan but you have to admire his dedication and also his underated skills.

 

Most of them were old, but let me point out that LaStarza was actually four years younger than Marciano, and was 37-0 for their first encounter, 53-3 for the rematch. Most of them were also around Marciano's size, but note that Louis was 6'2", a muscular 213, and was still a skilled top fighter in spite of his age (he had won eight straight fights in the last 11 months and beaten top 10 guys), and Marciano handled the differential pretty well.

Moreover, age and size are not the only factors in assessing a fighter's capability. For example, Archie Moore may have been old (38-42, depending on whose account you accept) and relatively small (though he was a big light heavyweight), but he was one of the greatest fighters of all time, had only lost one of his last 47 fights, that being a close decision to fellow all-time-great Harold Johnson, who he beat four times out of five, had won 21 consecutive fights and had beaten about half the heavyweight top 10 before facing Marciano. He went on to retain his light heavyweight title for another five years and only lost one of his next 35+ fights after Marciano, that being to another great champion in Floyd Patterson. Moore was old, but he was in his prime and was a very legitimate elite threat as a fighter.

While it is true that Marciano's opposition was weaker than that of some other champions (though it was also stronger than that of many), it is also true that virtually every other champion has lost to at least one opponent no better than Marciano's best opposition- Dempsey lost to fringe contender Willie Meehan, Louis lost to Max Schmeling, Ali lost to Norton, Tyson lost to Douglas, Holyfield lost to Moorer, Lewis lost to McCall and Rahman, etc.- and thus Marciano's undefeated career remains quite remarkable. Marciano faced and defeated the best fighters of his era, giving rematches every time the first fight wasn't decisive, decisively bested every man he ever faced, and retired without ever losing a fight, with the longest winning streak and highest knockout average of any linear heavyweight champion. He was quite possibly the hardest hitter of all time at his size, his stamina was inhuman, probably the best of any heavyweight champion in history, he was extremely durable, his heart was unfathomable, and he was actually a considerably more subtly-skilled fighter than many gave him credit for, as many of the men who actually got in the ring with him would tell you. It's hard to know how Marciano would do against elite fighters far bigger than himself like the ones we see today- perhaps he would be able to adjust, perhaps not- but his greatness within his own era is undeniable and in many ways unparalleled, and I think there is a strong argument for considering Marciano the favorite over any other sub-200-pound fighter in the history of the sport.

 

Most overrated "ATG".

 

atsch atsch atsch atsch


Oh dear ezz charles x 2, archie moore, joe walcott x 2 and an oldish joe louis who had only lost to schmeling and charles **** learn your stuff mate :good

also he was only 5'10 and usualy weighed under 190