How good was Liston's post Ali opposition?

Most of the men Liston fought post-title reign were journeyman level. Henry Clark was a decent fighter. Liston’s opponent selection wasn’t of his own making though. He had pretty much been black listed from any big fights and a lot of promoters wanted nothing to do with him which may explain why he left the states for ingemar Johansson to promote some of his later bouts.

 

Correct.

 

Pretty much this. I'd like to add other contenders didn't want much to do with him either. He was still dangerous, but none of the promotors would touch him, and/or give him a rating so he was very high risk-low reward.

 

He mostly fought guys who could have been named Willie Fall, Dusty Trunks and Ben Dover during his post-Ali ‘career.’

 

The best of the lot was hands down Leotis Martin who was a bad cat! Martin beat Thad Spencer, Al Lewis, Mildenberger etc. Of course we know Martin ended Liston's career via brutal knockout.

Martin's career was over as well after that fight because of a detached retna. Had he not been injured, who knows what he would of accomplished. I don't think he would have beaten Ali or Foreman but he would have been a problem for Frazier and Norton. Not saying he beats them but he certainly gives then tough fights.

 

Martin was a sparring partner and stablemate of Frazier. Their were rumors Frazier avoided him (which I don't believe).

 

Great post.

Whatever else he did in career, I think Martin fought a great fight vs Liston. He was taking a beating there for a while, badly swollen up - but he was tough and courageous, he hung in there and of course survived a hard knockdown also.

It was one of those game plans (sorta like Schmeling vs Louis 1 and Ali vs Foreman) in which a fair amount of punishment still had to be absorbed to see out the ultimate success of the strategy - and a primary component of that strategy was Martin’s persistent employment of a very good and hurtful jab, no matter what he was copping himself.

Martin clearly understood that if he was to win, the jab would pave the way for him. He stuck to the jab like his life depended on it.

Also, whatever his rep as a puncher otherwise, Martin did hit Liston with a perfect right hand, leaving Liston basically out on his feet - a left and then another right putting Sonny down for keeps.

If you didn’t see it - you might’ve found it hard to believe.

In fact, I picked up an old boxing mag. that was issued around the time of the KO loss - and it intimated that the KO was suspicious.

I can only guess the author hadn’t seen the fight but had only read the result - the film shows, as clear as day, that it was a legit KO.

 

A quantum shift towards bad over Liston's pre-Ali competition.

 

I think that had a lot to do with it yes. It was widely believed that he took a dive in that match. I also suspect ( with no proof ) that his dealings with the mafia maybe have been a red flag for some people.

 

Not saying he wasn't a bad cat but I think he got Liston at the right time. And wouldn't have beat him at his peak. Also think a few posters are overrating him. After Liston I think Frazier would have stopped him, not sure about Norton as Martin would have been on a roll.
Re Listons opposition after Ali I always thought they were all good fighters, but will have a look and maybe comment later. One I DO know about is Chuck Werner. Not brilliant but nails. And Liston made a mess of him.

 

I definitely think prime Liston destroys him and Frazier is no doubt the favorite over him. He simply has the best chance against Frazier and Norton had he been able to continue his career. He likely would have ended up as top contender like Quarry that simply came up short.

 

Pretty decent for man of his age and not significantly worse than Fury's or AJ's.