How Harmful Will Wladimir Klitschko's Unavenged...

They won't say that if Haye wins :hey Haye turned pro allot later than Povetkin, I'm sure if Haye stayed amateur he'd have won the olympics.

The olympics/amateur boxing doesnt mean much to the Pros, Audley Harrison won the olympics, so did Abudeleev, so did Pete Rademacher. They werent seen as great scalps

 

Harrison's just become a joke in recent years, Rademacher was fed into a meat grinder from day one.

Of course they weren't going to be great scalps to anyone.

 

Do you and Russell want to retract your statements?


here is the 2001 Ring Magazine Heavyweight Ratings

Lennox Lewis, Champion

1. Wladimir Klitschko
2. Mike Tyson
3. Chris Byrd
4. Hasim Rahman
5. Kirk Johnson
6. Evander Holyfield
7. John Ruiz
8. Jameel McCline
9. Fres Oquendo
10. David Tua

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here is the 2002 Ring Magazine Heavyweight Ratings


Lennox Lewis, Champion

1. Wladimir Klitschko
2. Chris Byrd
3. David Tua
4. Evander Holyfield
5. John Ruiz
6. Hasim Rahman
7. Vitali Klitschko
8. Kirk Johnson
9. Mike Tyson
10. Jameel McCline

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I disagree.

What the hell has Samuel Peter done? What the hell has Ibragimov done? What the hell has Brewster done?

What has Valuev done except lose after stepping up in class? What has Chageav done expect win a competitive fight against Matt Skelton? What has Povetkin done? Haye hasn't even fought at Heavyweight.

Wladimir isn't top 10 material, and beating any of those or even all of those would not change that.

 

Individually, those fighters don't bring much to the table legacy wise, but collectively, it would certainly be a good list of wins. Haye has been the most dominant cruiserweight since Evander Holyfield vacated the division over 20 years ago. Povetkin is one of the best heavyweight amateurs of all time, and has put together a nice win streak in the pros. Chagaev is undefeated in 25 fights, is holding one of the titles, and was the first to put a dent in Valuev's undbeaten record. Although, Wlad's schedule over the next 12-18 months may not be enough to place him among the elite, it will definately improve his resume and standing, should he manage to keep the "L's" off his record.

 

Peter's 27 years old for christs sake! Give him a few years before shooting down what he has and hasn't accomplished.

Brewster was a solid high end B level fighter who had more than a few decent wins, including a blowout in one over Golota. You know, the guy who Tyson needed two to get to quit due to an injury as opposed to knocking him out. Unbelievable power and heart as well if the Wlad fight didn't clue you in.

Career more than likely cut short due to retina problems.

And you're judging Haye when he, in your words, hasn't even yet fought at heavy?

 

I agree with this. Valuev has improved his boxing skills DRAMATICALLY in the last couple years. i am impressed. Young studs like potvekin haye chagaev would be huge legacy boosters

 

Brewster beat him via 3-knockdown rule in the first round.

A shot Tyson made him quit by pounding the **** out of him and making him quit in two rounds, after dropping him once in the first.

Both of these are pretty irrelevant though, because Golota choked every time he stepped up to the world-class level.

 

Riddick Bowe wasn't world class?

 

Riddick Bowe is the man

 

I didnt realize golota won these fights? I guess damaging another fights balls to the point where he could have a kid magnitutes a win in your book? just like "Headbutt KO" right?

 

You're missing the point.

Samuel Peter, Brewster, and Haye are all world class operators, but having their names on your CV does not constitute to a top 10 of all time level resume.

Boxing fans today seem to get over excited to quickly after a fighter reigns for a few years. Boxing has a 100 year history, and I can name 10 Heavyweights in the history of the division who have more accomplished resume than Wlad.

I don't know. Maybe one day he will be considered a true all time great, but having someone as vunerable as him in the same breath as Ali, Louis, and Holmes is ridiclious in my opinion.

 

There are problems with these wins:

Peter - got knocked down 3times against a very wide puncher

Brewster - coming off a loss and our of retirement with retina damage

Byrd - lost his next 2 after Wlad and got ko'd by a none rated LHW

 

No one is saying Ali, Louis or Holmes. Those can be viewed as top 5 guys. I am saying if Wlad cleans out this era, he can be top ten.

Here's an older article I posted a while back:
Who are the top all time 30 heavyweights? You can pick
your own. I'll list 30. Odds are we have matches on at
least 20 names, and likely 25 names. I'm not here to
debate any order, moreover just agree to a general
consensus on the names.

M. Ali,L. Holmes,J. Jeffries,J. Louis,S. Liston,G.
Foreman,L Lewis,J. Dempsey,R. Marciano,R. Bowe,E.
Holyfield,M. Tyson,J. Frazier,J. Johnson,V.
Klitschko,G. Tunney,K. Norton,S. Langford,B.
Fitzsimmons,J. Corbett,P. Jackson,H Wills,E. Charles,J
Walcott, F. Patterson,M Schmeling,J.L. Sullivan,T.
Witherspoon, and I.Ibeabuchi

Now that we have the names out of the way, I'll get to
my point. Is Wladimir Klitschko on his way to getting
on this list? Let's examine.

Current Winning percentage: 94.23%. 6th best of the
listed 30 fighters. Only Marciano, Tunney, Louis,
Ibeabuchi, and Bowe have higher winning percentages.

KO Percentage:84.61% 3rd best of the listed 30
fighters. Only Marciano and Vitlay Kltishcko are
higher. It is possible for Wlad to pass them both.

Heavyweight title bout record ( Alphabets included )
9-2. At the top of the list in terms of total wins and
percentage of wins. Some may roll their eyes at
counting alphabet title defenses. Coutner point. Is a
guy like Brock any worse than say half of Louis,
Ali's, Frazier, or Holmes title opponents? I think
not!

Amount of times KO'd. 3 times. Only 13 of the 30
fighters have been Ko'd less. Many traditionally
higher rated fighters were Ko'd more often, and in my
opinion by lesser punchers.

Size: Few were bigger

Hand Speed: Few had faster hands

Skills: Few had a better skills on offense or defense.

Power: Few hit harder.

Less bums: Wlad fought very few fighters with losing
records

All over 200 pounds: Wlad has always fought
heavyweights.

No color or geographical line: Wlad has never used the
color line and has fought the best fighters from all
over the world.

Is Wlad on his way to making a top 30 all time list? I
think so!

The Brewster win puts Wlad in the top 20 for now. Wlad
is in his prime. A time when physical skills,
experience, and confidence are all at high levels. I
can't see more popular fighters like Charels, Walcott,
Patterson, or Schemling getting the better of Wlad in
a 3 fight series.

 

I stopped reading after awhile but I'll put it this way so that we no longer have to debate over Wladimir Klitschko.

If he doesn't lose up until he retires from now on, I will quite happily consider him a top 10 heavyweight. I say this because it most probably won't happen. Any puncher in his division can take him out, which is why I find it hard to rate him that highly.

Deal?