How much of a chance do the following men have against Pep?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Tin_Ribs, Aug 5, 2010.


  1. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Just a random, unoriginal idea after mcvey started the Driscoll-Pep thread yesterday. So.....


    Pedroza? I know that Pep had lost his edge by the time Saddler got to him, but their series has always given me an inkling that Pedroza could have given Pep what might be described as a considerable headache. Tall, fast, strong on the inside and a dirty ******* to boot. Not to say that Pedroza necessarily wins though.

    Marcel? It's these Panamanians......quick, slick and a pain in the arse.

    Saldivar? Tracking down good movers and outfighters was a particular talent of his.

    Chocolate? Just been watching the 1st Canzoneri fight again so I decided to chuck him into the mix. Great talent he was....

    Arizmendi? Or does his style play too much into Pep's hands?

    Barrera circa 2001? Just because I like him. I think that Pep's quickness and flurrying ability would ultimately outdo him, but I could still see him putting up a terrific fight.


    Name some others if you like - people who think would've had a good chance at not stumbling hypnotically after the Wisp and end up drowning in the swamps.
     
  2. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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  3. Duodenum

    Duodenum Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Pedroza's body attack might pose some issues for Pep. Eusebio might not even bother trying for Willie's head. A tallish featherweight who could take it inside. Not saying he'd beat Pep, but he'd not likely be much of a picnic either.
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Pedroza gives Pep a rough time, but lacks Saddlers fire power,I think prime Willie takes a dec,but he'd better have a good foul proof cup on.

    Marcel was very good ,but Pep was great ,he does nearly everything a bit better imo .Pep by dec.

    Saldivar proved that he could handle great jabbers in his series with Winstone,the southpaw lead takes a lot of the effectiveness away from the left jabber,but Pep was far swifter on his feet than Winstone
    .Pep takes a dec.

    The Kid's speed would trouble Willie but as, Berg proved you could figure him out,Pep takes a close dec.

    Arizmendi would be a foil for Willie imo,strong and very durable but Willie would time his rushes and pile up points.Dec win.

    MAB gives him a terrific fight and hurts him to the body but loses a points dec.

    Driscoll , as near to Pep in talent and, with right cross power.Very close fight.

    Sanchez, I think gets out boxed Cowdell gave him a competitive fight and he was not in Pep's class.
     
  5. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Cheers fella. Agreed on most points, though I tend to think that Pedroza's slickness & ability to put shots together well sort of compensates for his having less power than Saddler. Whether or not it's enough.......

    It was the cat-like agility of Chocolate that made me think he could provide an interesting stylistic challenge to Pep enough to pose a serious threat. Berg, Canzoneri, LaBarba & Battalino were different animals in that sense.

    Agree Willie's all wrong for Sal Sanchez though. Good points observations regarding Saldivar too. I'd lean towards Pep but wouldn't be surprised to see Saldivar's patience and late charge catch Pep out.

    If Arizmendi could wrangle his way inside Pep's jab and keep it there, well.....it's interesting. I think that Pep probably outmanoevres him though. Spins him around at ring-centre too often.

    Barrera.......fluid, intelligent and deadly accurate enough to cause some serious trouble, but perhaps too static and hittable against men who were quicker than him.
     
  6. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Saldivar has the best chance followed by Marcel. The rest have negligible chances imo.
     
  7. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Great insight.
     
  8. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Care to expand?

    Personally I reckon Pedroza has the best chance for reasons outlined but then I do not think he wins.

    Marcel for me is quite similar to Pep in the regards he is slick and quick and always in motion, changing angles and firing shots. What a technical fight that would be though?

    Also on Chocolate vs Pep, Fidel LaBarba was shorter and used his jab to great extent in beating Chocolate, Pep IMO has a brilliant jab aaginst taller men and could throw the Kid out of his rythm as LaBarba did, although it is closeish. How tall is Chocolate, he looks fairly tall and could bring it inside aswell? and many think that could be a blueprint to beat Pep.
     
  9. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    This is the gist that had me interested in Chocolate's chances against Pep: whether or not Pep's overall generalship - his ability to outjab taller men included - would 'solve' Chocolate and negate his speed and physicality.

    I think Chocolate was about 5'6ish, which wouldn't have been all that much of an advantage (Willie was about 5'5 if I remember rightly), if actually an advantage at all. Not like Saddler, or Pedroza for that matter. He could though bring it inside like you said, although so could Pep when all's said and done - he tried to give Saddler quite a bit of stick in return before succumbing and was seemingly good at tangling opponents and spinning them into more manageable positions.
     
  10. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Pep could really out-rhythm a guy with his jab, and kock him off his game with a double or triple jab and a slight angle. I reckon that is a major factor in this bout, although Chocolate definitly proved himself as a varied and dynamic technician in the Canzoneri fights so his changes would really make the fight interesting.

    I just think Pep is the slightly better ring general and can force Chocolate to change rather than letting him adapt.
     
  11. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Aye, this is what it might fizzle down to in the end. Neat observation on the variety of Pep's jab btw, even if we don't have the best of him to pore over.

    How d'you like the odds of Armstrong toppling Pep? That I could see......
     
  12. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    I've always called it even before with both guys cancelling each other out abit, but I reckon now that each guy has more sucess than I previously thought. I reckon Pep can keep him off balance at times with his change of angles and combinations (because people forget Pep was a busy bee aswell) and Armstrong has sucess with his workrate and forcing Pep back.

    Armstrong was slightly raw at the weight so I can see a tight Pep decision, but in all honesty I think it comes down to styles and generally a swarmer gives a boxer hell when they are of similar level and with both guys so evenly matched it has to come down to that.

    What a clash of styles though, similar to Chang vs Zapata IMO.
     
  13. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Cheers for pishing all over that nice little bonfire I was about to get going GP. How am I going to try hoodwinking people into thinking that my brain works when you keep hogging all the good answers?

    I'll just go back to sitting in the wheelbarrow in my undies and building matchstick men out of my own earwax.......

    Nevermind, I think that Zapata was a bit less offensively orientated than Pep at times, perhaps by choice rather than inability. Gave Chang less to respect or fear so to speak than what Pep might've given Hank.
     
  14. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    :lol::lol:

    Its still a 50-50 match up, open to a few different ideas, its probablky my favrouite match up.

    I agree Zapata was less offensivly orientated as you say and allowed Chang more leeway than he should have been given but the basic style match up is there and the way Zapata did at times offset Changs ferocious attack. Although saying that I do think Chang lacked his usual intensity in that match up but that is an aside. Basically where Zapata would make you miss, Pep would hit you with a jab make you miss then hit you again.
     
  15. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Sure. Saldivar was great at cutting off the ring and was technically skilled enough not to get hit too much coming in against boxers. He proved time and again that he had the measure of some superb boxers (e.g Winstone x 3 and Laguna). Even when he was past his prime he proved he could deal with quality boxer types (e.g. Famechon, Legra).

    Pedroza, for as good as he was in an overall sense, wasn't really great in the facets needed to beat Pep. He wasn't great at cutting off the ring (he let Bernard Taylor dance around him for 15 rounds) and he wasn't the best outboxer either.

    Marcel, though not the best ring cutter either, is probably the only one on that list that could seriously compete with Pep from the outside. To me he is a much better fighter from the outside than Pedroza because he is quite a bit quicker and snappier with his shots.