How much weaker would a UFC 8-man HW tournament be?

I've already stated that I don't think either company has a clear advantage over the other, so you can't just weakly label me as pro-zuffa.

How can you say the UFC is a league behind? Werdum may not be your favorite to win, but with wins over Fedor and Overeem, he has to be the tournament's #1 seed. Werdum lost to Dos Santos, a fighter in the UFC.

Overeem may go on to be the best in the world at the end of this tournament, but he is nothing more than a prospect with his current resume. Lesnar's wins over Herring, Couture, Carwin, and Mir trump anything Overeem has done as a heavyweight in MMA. Overeem's best win is over Brett Rogers.

Kharitonov hasn't done anything of note in years. He is 1-1 in his last two fights, his loss coming against Jeff Monson.

Arlovski is riding a 3 fight losing streak.

Cain, Mir, Nogueira, and Carwin are easily more relevant than Kharitonov or Arlovski.

Barnett is on a 6 fight win streak, but the most significant thing he has done in years is make Affliction fold by juicing in preparation for Fedor.

 

Strikeforce has the better roster IMO.

 

So much truth being spoken here.

Cro Cop and Nogueira are seen as being shot because they fight in the UFC. If they had fought the same level of opposition as Barnett they'd be heralded as world beaters. Arlovski is on a three-fight losing streak and his last meaningful victory came via crooked refereeing. Kharitonov may as well have been on a sabbatical for all his done in MMA over the past few years. Werdum flammed out of the UFC, going 2-2 and being demolished by JDS.

I would genuinely be more interested in the strikeforce tournament if they included some of their younger heavyweights. Why is Brett Rogers in the tournament ahead of Daniel Cormier?

 

I'd say the reality is that theres a question mark over the level of the guys on the "other" half of the draw of the SF event BUT I do still see all of them as having the potential to fight at the elite level.

I do not see either Nog or Crocop as having that potential anymore.

 

Struve deserves a place, definitely. I quite like Struve, he's got balls.

 

This speaks volumes as to the sheer lack of depth and quality in the UFC heavyweight division. Struve? What next Ben Rothwell?

 

I never said the UFC division had a huge depth, but neither does Strikeforce's, man. They have Fedor and Overeem and possibly Barnett is still relevant, that's great. Arlovski and Werdum are former UFC dropouts and Rogers is as relevant as Shane Carwin. UFC has JDS and Velasquez. And big heavy hitters such as Nelson or Carwin. It's not their fault Fedor won't sign a contract with them. I can't speak for Overeem though.

Struve's been doing well recently though, but yeah, Ben Rothwell is horrible. To be honest though, all round heavyweights are hard to find, especially in MMA. You can't expect that division to be riddled with BJJ purists or submission specialists. They hit like tanks, and there's very few who can take punches off eachother. They're gonna be like flies falling. obviously.

 

I stopped reading here. Overeem has more fights than the top 4 UFC heavyweights combined. He has more losses than Cain has had fights.
SF's heavy's currently have so much depth that they're actually able to put on a VERY competitive GP. Fedor Overeem Barnett Werdum all boast experience far far in excess of the UFC's top heavys. In addition their second tier of heavys AA Bigfoot Kharitnov are also far more experienced and successful than the flotsam at the bottom of the UFC division.

 

Fair fair, but I don't agree with UFC's heavyweight division being thrown aside.

 

Is that supposed to be indicative of how good Overeem is? Overeem has lost more fights than Cain has participated in, and his best win is against Brett Rogers. How is he not ranked not #1 on anyone's list?

 

Exactly man, and just because guys like those lack a huge amount of experience, if they've got the skills and like a Carwin or Nelson does, have extreme power in their hands, it evens it all out. Fedor and Overeem are one of a kind athletes, who happen to be signed to the same promotion. It's not like UFC have never tried to grab them, but you'd be foolish to say there's nothing there. Even lurking in the challengers rankings there's always something there. How many challengers are in Strikeforce's rankings, pray tell? Arlovski? Rogers? Silva? They seem to enjoy blowing their loads quite quickly and having a lot of dead weight left around most of the time.

 

Im afraid it has to be. As apart from JDS and Cain the rest are just insignificant.

 

This is a straw argument. Overeems ability is indicative of the fact he has won the DREAM title the SF title and the K-1. He's pedigree is PROVEN. Iv never said he should be ranked number 1 in MMA. But its ABUNDANTLY clear he has oodles more experience than the UFC's top 4 premier heavyweights which is what the original point topic was about.