How was Liston viewed in his prime?

I heard/read he was widely regarded as almost unbeatable. People thought, he is the possible successor of Joe Louis and he could be worldchampion for around 10 years. But that`s just what I read, I`m not contemporary witness.

 

There were those who argued that he could have beaten anybody.

Obviously his reputation nosedived after the Ali fights.

 

As he was; a juggernaut. Possible of beating any heavy that ever lived.

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Do you, Mr. Morlocks?

 

At times. Except for Dempsey.

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I think after Liston flattened Floyd for the second time people must have thought Sonny might be a champion forever. In these sorts of situations a search often begins to discover if it can really be possible that the champion really is so good.

I have old Ring Magazines from the Ingo/Floyd rematch period where Sonny is indeed looked upon as a future champion. Certainly by the time of the Folley win. And Sonny had been written up as a promising contender from about 1959/60.

And yet there other articles that look to smear Liston because of his underworld connections. The world was very much a different place then and future champions were hoped to be a lot more wholesome than they actually were. There was a lot of ink used on the mystery around his changing management and continuing rehabilitations with catholic priests.

“Telephone company records indicate that one of Liston's opponents called John Vitale several times just before he was knocked out by Liston. There is speculation among highly qualified boxing men that several of Sonny's opponents have taken dives, no doubt without Sonny's knowledge. One well-placed boxing official suspects at least six fights were fixed.

But Sonny certainly looked good when he defeated Zora Folley last July, a fight which no one questions. His dreary win over Eddie Machen last fall did not, however, enhance his reputation.” - sports illustrated.

In 1964 sports illustrated published an in-depth article called “The Four who baffled Liston” which really gives some insight into how far a study was going just to find a flaw in him.

Former fighters however rated Sonny. Marciano rated him. As well as this I think it was Beau Jack who said he thought Sonny was an even better fighter than Joe Louis.

 

I wasn't around then but it seems he was rated highly and was the Foreman and Tyson of his time .... The original intimidating, threatening champion

 

I have an old The Ring magazine from before the first Liston - Patterson fight. They polled 50 or maybe 100 people in boxing about the fight and had them pick a winner. It was about 50-50 with a lot of people commenting that Liston was stiff and slow. He was definitely not seen as unbeatable at that time. I would guess that after the first fight, the media and public were probably more impressed with Liston, but it's doubtful that a one round knockout would have changed the opinion of the boxers and trainers who were polled.

 

“But Monroe Harrison his former trainer, although he remains a Liston fan, acknowledges shortcomings in his style. "He has a push jab," he says, "with a lot of power, but I'd have shortened up his jab. He misses with his right, because his jab is so powerful it knocks the man back so he isn't there when he swings the right. If they give him the title fight within a year and a half, I favor Liston. Otherwise, it's Patterson. Liston'll be too big, too old later on.”

 

Then as now, a fighters standing tended to be based upon their most recent fight.

People are high in Fury now, because he is coming off a good result, but if he has a bad result in his next fight, people will revise down their estimates of him considerably.

After the two Patterson fights, some people thought that Liston might be the head to head GOAT.

After the two losses to Ali, some people thought that he would have lost to Max Baer.

 

100% correct. still true.
Now if I said this the forum would explode!

 

Yet he quit twice against the first what I would call modern large green Heavy with skills.......neither Frazier or Foreman quit against a past prime version of Ali despite taking a beating in three out of four fights......

Sonny Liston is the most hysterically over rated Champ on this board, that does not mean he was not a formidable opponent but nevertheless he is totally unproven against what we call modern Heavies.

Also , Liston never redeemed himself after Clay, he ran his mouth but never ever got himself into serious title contention ever again, and no, it was not the press or the Mob, it was him who did not put the work in until he OD'ed.

 

According to some on this board, Liston was 28 years old when he fought Floyd the second time and 49 when he fought Ali the first time.

No fighter ever aged so much, so fast.