How would Duran retiring after Montreal affect his standing?

Rated higher.

 

Because he survived it was one of the best losing efforts ever?? IMO Hagler dominated that fight and it wasn't remotely close to what the judges had scored. *thank God he clearly won the last two rounds*.

But to answer your question, I believe he still would be a Top 10 ATG, the Leonard win was that huge.

 

It would probably be assumed he'd always beat Leonard and Leonards great later accomplishments boost him further. His weak lightweight competition would probably be made a bigger deal over as would the fact he only fought 2 top WWs

Allot of Durans achievement is reliant on Leonards though. What if Leonard retired after Duran 2? Duran would be rated far lower

 

I agree, but I honestly believed Hagler held back in that fight. He showed way too much respect for Duran.

 

Buchanan, Dejesus x 3, Ernesto Marcel (granted below 135), Ray Lampkin, Hector Thompson, Viruet brothers, Mamby, etc. Weak???

As for the question, I think his legacy would be about the same. Quitting against Leonard, and his no show performances cancel out the Barkley, Hagler, Moore, imo.

 

Im not going to go into it but most consider it weak Dejesus/Buchanan aside

 

Well Duran did acomplish much after that fight Barkley,Moore, and showed his skill vs Hagler but the problem with Duran at that point in time was the party mode caught up with him and he could not retain the condition of Montreal. Duran was a giant in Panama and it got to him, like Tyson he was surrounded by sycophants and suffered from every vice from soda pop to Coke and had his choice of spanish woman....I think if he had retired at that pinacle at 71-1 it would have been a snapshot of perfection.

 

A good question.

If he retired after Montreal a lot of people would have criticised him for not giving Leonard a rematch, leaving lots of unanswered questions.

Ironically, the rematch with Leonard is unfortunately what he's most remembered for with casual boxing fans and the public.

I also think his LW competition would have been questioned, as mentioned above (although i don't myself considerate it to be that weak you could easily make an argument that it wasn't as strong as Benny's.

Overall I think his ranking would have been about the same, although personally I'm glad he continued as his fights with Hagler, Barkley and Moore are some of the most enjoyable fight I've ever seen.

 

I agree, but I think it was very, very close. Hagler was way too gun-shy.

 

People seem to be quite happy making excuses for his losses. That said, he doesn't gain much extra currency for his weight-jumping antics in comparison to his longevity at 135 and the Leonard/Palomino wins, so taking that away might not make a massive difference. I think, overall, his H2H rating would have been about the same - people might not have taken so seriosuly the idea that he could be out-brawling a Barkley had it not happened, but they certainly wouldn't have picked him to lose to Benitez. (In a thread a while back, people seemed to think that a prime Duran would have beaten pretty much anybody at 147.) In terms of achievements, I think the Barkley, Moore and Hagler performances probably come close to balancing his embarassing moments. Making excuses really works.

 

The real test would be how this comes out under a calculated comparison system (didn't Sweet Scientist have one of these?). Aesthetic considerations obviously determine the extent to which we prize weight-jumping over consistency etc.

 

I know a lot of fans DO make excuses for Duran especially for the impossible to be sure what was going on behidn the scenes leonard rematch, but he seems to polarise opinions in the opposite manner as well.

You aren't even allowed to say he was above his best weight and past his best for his losses post Leonard rematch anymore without being called to task on it.

The cultured, educated observer who is a fan of the sport in general and not just certain fighters realises there is more truth than Carl Williams in those statements.

 

he is top 2 or 3 but the lost to leonard set the record straight that he should be outside top 5