How would prime Larry Holmes go in the current era ?

I picked a set of weights between Holmes and Foreman from a short peak period. He beat Frazier at 217 1/2, Norton at 224 3/4 and fought Ali at 220. Holmes was 209-215 from winning the title thru numerous defenses before aging. Foreman looked huge but in reality wasn't immensely bigger than a Holmes, not at all. I'll readily grant Foreman was much stronger and looked bigger than most anyone around his weight range.

No way in the world was Foreman, a heavyweight, weight drained at the weights he fought Norton, Frazier and Ali at. Being well trained and in your best shape at heavyweight doesn't = weight drained.

 

Foreman apparently would "dry out" because of some old-timey belief that it helped. So I'm not so sure.

 

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foreman at 19 in the amateurs ,listen the video... 226 pounds at 19 years old
and tell me that he did not look in great shape, slender, not packed of added mass, he had very big frame. if you can make 226 pounds at 18-19 looking like that... you are naturally a pretty big guy. nor bowe nor lewis were that heavy even at 22. Foreman was naturally around 15-20 pounds heavier than holmes. if you give holmes 210( he was much lighter in the most of fighst in his mid 20s),

 

Again you have no idea what you are talking about.

What Foreman weighed as an amateur has NO BEARING on his prime fighting weight. Most historians and George himself say his best prime performances were vs Frazier in 73 and Norton. Average out his weights and you get around a 220 pound hwt.

Holmes best wins and the bouts where he trained the hardest were against Norton, Ali and Cooney. Average his weights and you get around a 210 pound Hwt.

So we are talking in terms of prime weight a 10 pound difference. However the difference in weight whether 10, 15 or 25 pounds would have NO BEARING on the outcome. Focusing in on weight is a calling card for a poster who has limited knowledge of hwt boxing. Last thing you should be considering with this hypothetical matchup.

 

I've seen snippets about this but nothing concrete. Foreman's got a fair bit of mystery about him actually, from first career all the way thru.

 

the point is that foreman was a much bigger man you dumb ****, nobody is saying that it would be the key to win the fight.
the weight of a fighter ( being in good physical shape) in his amateur career at young age is a great indicative about his natural size.
again the rat of keyboard, first go and train boxing a single day of your life and then come back to speak about a sport that you have practiced

 

Prime Foreman did not have a 15-20 pound weight advantage over Prime Holmes...PERIOD. Why you want to inflate the weight difference I have no idea as it has no bearing on this bouts results (unless Foreman comes into the bout grossly out of shape).

Size SHOULD BE the LAST THING you should be looking at concerning this hypothetical matchup of ATG hwt champions.

Holmes had the STYLE AND SKILL to outbox the slugger. Just like Ali, just like Young both did to George.

 

Joshua would defeat him,wilder ???Holmes didnt like jabbing up...i would suspect these guys are a bit harder to fight than the smaller 80's guys he fought. Cooney with the exception gave Holmes all he could handle but would assume he is top 5 for sure though,he would out box guys like Parker and Ortiz ,probably wilder too. He doesnt beat Wlad/Joshua and has a hard time with Haye, maybe Fury.

 

One thing about Holmes is that he didn't clean out the division as much as some other ATG heavies did. He didn't fight Coetzee, Tate, Dokes, Lyle, Pink, Tubbs, etc. Sometimes it was his fault and sometimes it wasn't. I don't know that he would've been undefeated for so long if he rolled the dice for often. The division is pretty strong right now but the good fights rarely get made. I don't think Holmes could run through Fury, Old Wlad, Ortiz, Wilder, Haye, Povetkin, Parker, Usyk, and Joshua without taking a loss or two. I do think he'd be the best (because Wlad is faded).

 

you use the jimmy young fight against him as argument in a fantasy fight against holmes right? well, if you take this fight as reference in order to attack him don't ignore his weight conveniently, he weighed 229 pounds.You ALWAYS use his fight with jimmy young to ATTACK him in fantasy matches prime vs prime, but then when we argue about size you ignore conveniently his weight for this fight and you use his 217 pounds against frazier in order to make him look smaller but you are constantly cherry picking the highest weights of the fighter that you are defending, pathetic.
so YES!!! ,FOREMAN WAS 15-20 POUNDS HEAVIER AND BIGGER Period!!!

 

How much did the extra weight help him against Young?

 

it was not extra weight!!! it was his natural weight, he looked great in his late 20s weighing even more against other guys ,his performance against young has nothing to do with the weight.
The point is that he uses this fight in order to attack him in fantasy matches but when he is debating with anyone about who is naturally the bigger fighter he uses his 217 pounds for frazier as reference. This guy is a biased clown

 

unbeaten.

 

undefeated, pretty easy.