I Bet A Peak James Toney Could Give Greb A Hard Night

I tend to think of how he dealt with Jirov until he punched himself nearly out of stamina by simply staying on the ropes and slipping and blocking with great counters but.......everything we read of Greb was running out of steam no matter how hard the fight was never an issue and it seems he got meaner and busier the longer the fight....I love me some Toney a true old school fighter and a throw back defensive talent a true master....Damn if we could just get a film of a typical Greb fight....I hear you on hyperbole I base my opinion off of a very straight forward no frills Gene Tunney opinions and some others in which the typical hyperbole like Nat Fleischer specialized in is not part of their descriptions just solid intelligent hard to impress people were impressed by Greb and that is where I lean. I tend to avoid the mainstream writers for that very reason now having said that I am open to the idea he has somehow become invincible simply because their is no film and hyperbole as overtaken reason like previous generations......I just feel that some of the not so contemporary mainstream types were completely impressed and without wavering thought he was the best.

 

He looked his best in the last round of that fight though. I don't think he punched himself out much at all

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he was far better in round 12 than he had been earlier.

 

I meant Jirov punched himself out Toney no matter how fat or thin seemed to be able to fight the entire fight

 

I wasn't comparing Greb to them stylewise. I referenced them because those were fights where it appeared a man (great fighter) fought a boy (nowhere near in ability or skill) to give an example of what I said the fight would be like.

 

Even worse. Peak Toney gives no fighter an easy night. Much less a swarmer.

 

Are you being purposely obtuse? I just explained that.

 

You did and I objected to your explanation. No fighter makes a PEAK James Toney look like a man vs a boy.

 

From the descriptions of Greb he sounds like a bouncy, rubber ball version of Calzaghe, except that he was busier, if that's even possible. I'm not sure how much success Toney would have in countering Greb given that it doesn't sound like Greb loaded up on his punches much and used constant motion and angles to befuddle his opposition.

What giver Toney some ray of hop is that Tunney managed to slow Greb down somewhat by going to the body, and Toney employed a similar tactic against Nunn. So I guess it's possible - but imho Tunney didn't necessarily beat a peak Greb and enjoyed a considerable weight advantage over him when he had his most clear-cut wins. And let's not forget that Nunn was mopping the floor with Toney until Toney's strategy paid off.

Greb was reputed to have a solid chin and fantastic stamina; to me it seems that Toney would somehow have to stop Greb to win, and I'm not sure that he could. Most likely it would be Greb on points, imo.

 

Mopping the floor is a bit strong. Winning yes, but every round was hard fought and Toney had moments in them all.

 

Greb isn't 6'2 or a lefty.Even with speed equal to Nunn's Greb would get beat up on the way in. Worse than Nunn did because of a closer match up with the reach.

 

Probably along the lines of Calzaghe v Hopkins.

Shhhiiitter of a fight.

 

A good thread but note your..."compared to modern fighters". How about a Greb born decades later or a Toney born decades earlier? My continuing (decades debate) certainly warrants consideration. When you bring up a 'what-if' fight several decades apart it's difficult to envision a match outcome between two so and so's.

 

Toneys style is so nice to watch int it. Shame he's a roaster.

 

Yet somehow Greb managed not to get caught on the way in abuot 290 fights... against 13 Hall of Famers... against middles, lightheavies and heavyweights... hmmm...

 

He did have 8 loses.
This is why I hate debating about Greb. Because James is a flesh and blood person and we all see him for both his greatness and his flaws. But No way are some people going to be honest about Greb. He was a great fighter for sure. But we are denied by the lack of film to see the holes in his game.