I don't understand why people say Holmes got robbed twice against Spinks.

Honestly, a case can be made either way in their first fight.

In the rematch I felt Holmes won by a wide margin. It was a robbery in my opinion.

Holmes vs. Witherspoon? Close, wouldn't argue with a draw. I felt Holmes pulled it out though.

Holmes vs. Williams? Again close, wouldn't argue too much over a draw. I thought Holmes did just enough for the win though.

Norton? Close fight, I thought Holmes won but a case can be made for a draw.

Holmes and Norton should have fought again... Norton lost to Shavers in brutal fashion in 1979 though.

It would have been good had Holmes added the WBA belt and kept the WBC and WBA belts together.

 

Come on now Bummy... you have no problem with M. Spinks winning the HW World Title from Holmes in a close fight... but Holmes can't regain the title from M. Spinks in a close fight??? Isn't that a bit hypocritical?

Go watch the rematch again. Holmes was active, he rocked Spinks thruout the fight, he landed the harder punches and pressed the action... what more do you want?

 

Holmes really hurt himself by being so unlikable. He just never came across as more than an angry guy. If he would have lightened up, dropped the Marciano jock strap comments I think he would have been thought of as an even greater fighter today.

 

I scored both fights for Spinks.

 

I always liked Holmes. I was only 3 1/2 when he beat Ken Norton... so I grew up watching Holmes during his HW World Title reign. He didn't get drunk and wreck cars. He wasn't a drug addict. He didn't blow his money. He wasn't flashy. He wasn't overly c0cky. He didn't drop his hands and stick his chin out. He was a little bitter, so what? He didn't beat and **** women. He didn't have 11 children with 9 different women. He didn't pretend to be a saint. He was a regular dude who worked hard and became a great fighter.

I loved the street fight vs. Berbick, I even liked the Marciano comment. No disrespect to Marciano... he just felt like he was robbed, big deal... he said he was sorry. He didn't use vulgar language... remember his comment, "...and since we're on HBO, that's my big black behind"?

Too bad there wasn't some more interesting fighters for Holmes to fight during his prime. Shavers x2, Norton, Ali, and Cooney... maybe even Cobb, being the most colorful characters he did face.

I think he would have outpointed Foreman had they fought in the 90's.

 

I have to watch it again but typically back then Champ held title in a close fight. Holmes did it vs Witherspoon and Williams and many thought Holmes lost both. I have not watched fight 2 probably since it happened but I remember it being closer than the 1st, either way no one expected Holmes to lose to Spinks in Michaels 1st fight at heavyweight in 1st fight, Spinks was one of the weakest challengers at the time

 

I rewatched the 11th round and still had Holmes winning it. I watched it with the volume off. The first minute of the round Larry is popping the jab and Spinks is backing away and covering up, dodging, tying up. He is barely throwing a punch in return. In the second minute Larry is still the aggressor and jabbing. Spinks lands several good punches in rapid succession on Holmes. While a number of other attempts were clearly missing or cuffing around the back of Holmes head. Spinks was landing at his best in the last minute of the round but he also got hit back with a variety of Holmes punches in the form of head, body shots and jabs. That's what I saw. So, I saw the first minute for Larry, second minute for Spinks and the 3rd minute for Larry as he landed the more authoritative shots, and was landing those while moving forward.

Then again, I am somewhat biased as I dislike Spinks style with a passion.

 

Between 1981-1984 Doakes, Coetzee, Thomas were all rated #1 and Page was rated in the top 3. All of them were unbeaten for a few years while they held their high rating and Holmes missed all them. People give Dempsey endless hell for Wills but name another long reigning HW Champion who missed as many top rated challengers including three #1's?

 

Its called Espn mist, they watch espn documentaries about larry being one of the best and then become blind to clear FACTS that despite being good he lost and drawed with alot of guys where he got the decisions so don king could keep making money. Spinks beat him twice fair and squar, he drawed the fights you mentioned. Larry was more marketable and that is why he got the wins, clear as day.

 

I have been saying this for years but I guess a lot of the posters did not live the era and are catching up on Holmes history...Holmes avoidance of co-champions and #1 make Dempsey pale (LOL) in comparison

 

That's definitely me. I have been familiarizing myself with that era and his reign and have come away rather suprised to see what he missed. Most surprising is the almost total lack of criticism for it, compare that to what Lennox and Klychko recieve. What makes it worse is all the guys outside the top 10 he fought during those years Frazier, Frank, Rodriguez, Cobb.

 

Some do , some don't .. some make the argument about only the rematch ... the bottom line is that Holmes likely got screwed n the rematch because he was highly unpopular at the time and it was unfortunate ...

 

I think a lot of posters are ignorant to the era, Holmes was a well conditioned guy and had a Great Jab but he avoided many of his top contenders while fighting the unranked and never unified, its funny when I see criticism about Dempsey and others but the same people don't mention Holmes....Larry had some good fights but never rematched a hard fight or unified and avoided many, its a shame because I think he would have beaten most of them but it annoyed me at the time and still does

 

Same old Bummy w the same old Holmes Doctrine ... believes if he says it enough it actually impacts the facts .... perhaps to draw an equal comparison to Dempsey you can back up your statement by naming the title contender that was number one for Holmes whole reign that he did not fight ... after that, give us Santas address ... :nut

 

C'mon He Grunt who did Dempsey not fight, OK Harry Wills OK Greb, Holmes gave up a title not to fight Page, never rematched Weaver,Williams,Witherspoon,Norton after close fights did not unify against Tate,Thomas,Coetzee,Weaver,Dokes and fought numerous guys who were not rated in top 10 also fought 10-2-2 Leon Spinks who was previously KO'd in 1 rd by Coetzee, he fought 10 fight Marvis Frazier, 14 fight David Bey, 13 fight Ossie Ocasio 14-1 James Smith, Scott Frank, Lucien Rodriguez, Renaldo Snipes(who was just dropped2X by Coetzee and King robbed Gerrie of a Holmes match,his other defenses were Leroy Jones (who I saw get beat up by a middleweight in the gym) Scott Ledoux, Evangelista, Zanon, and Tex Cobb......I would have to say Holmes best win was over Gerry Cooney (who never fought past 8 rounds) and Earnie Shavers but remember Shavers was also Ko'd by Ron Stander beaten & dropped for a 9 count by 20-25 Bob Stallings, KO1 Quarry KO 6 Ron Lyle....all before he fought Holmes and throw in light heavyweight Stan Johnson