If Bradley Is Legit Opposition For Pac, Does That Mean Ortiz Was Legit For Floyd?

This sounds like you are just too worried about what posters say. Once you realize what's said on this board is NOT indicative of reality most of the time, makes it much easier to just blow off.

However, that said, those aren't excuses if they are valid. And FLoyd and Pac are both guilty of that. But when you choose to fight a LW, then yes, he's obviously naturally too small. When you choose to fight guys near 40, chances are, they are old (didn't say TOO OLD). Not being skilled enough (not sure where that comes from) means jack **** if the guy is winning. And Floyd made those choices, so he has to live with them.

As fot Hatton, since I'm sure he's one you think excuses are made for. Well, you choose to guight a guy who's 5'6" and stocky, one whos success was ALL at 140, there again, there will be valid criticism made. Doesn't matter if floyd would beat him at any weight, WHICH I agree he would. But he didn't.

:huh You're just picking parts of certain arguments, and trying to apply them to other things.

Like I said, Shane WAS old. Was he young to you? That doesn't mean he was shot either, but anyone who's seen Shane fight would see he is past his prime, just as he was vs. Pac. There's no seperate rules, and the fact that you think it changed w/ Ortiz is just naivete.

Obvioulsy there are no perfect opponents for everyone. But when you carefully choose, then you open yourself for criticism.

Your beef just seems to be about "arguments" or what fans say. Look at the fighters, not what posters say.

Jesus christs....NO ONE said he HAS to be young. That's something you guys keep arguing about. That stupid fans just added on their own. It's pointless. A the very least, they should have a few big wins. Ortiz had NONE. Don't you get it? And beating a Berto who had none of his own, doesn't exactly fit the bill.

So play your games with all these arguments. Run in circles, because that's all it is. Chasing your tail. Hopefully, sooner or later, you realize the "Us vs. Them" **** isn't boxing and means very little.

 

When Margarito was offered to Mayweather in 2006 for 8mil and Mayweather was "ducking him". His only major win at the time was Kermit Cintron who like Berto was only an up and coming fighter who was yet to beat anybody of notice.

Ortiz had a better overall resume with Maidana, Harris, Campbell, Peterson, Berto then Margarito did when he was offered the fight with Mayweather. The only reason why the match up was intriguing was because of Margarito's size and chin thats why he had his high rating it wasn't because Margarito established himself by beating major comp. Margaritio didn't establish himself comp wise until 2008 when he had fights with Clottey, Williams, Cintron 2, and Cotto.

 

No, that was the only name you knew. Margarito had MORE wins over Ring ranked WW's at the time then Judah, Baldomir, and Floyd COMBIMED. That is not opinion, it's fact that he been discussed before and written about. Not to mention, he was the only one defending his belt successfully.

Berto has no wins over Ring ranked WW's.

Bull****. atsch It's almost as if you weren't payin much attention 6 years ago.

 

Ortiz was the number 3 welterweight in the world.

Basically he was the best welterweight not called Manny or Floyd,and coming of a big win.

Bradley is also a legit opponent.

They're both legit opponents,but they're the guys we want these 2 fighters to fight.Namely each other.

 

Both are legit opponents but neither will add much to their resume I'm terms of legacy.

Bradley is better P4P but I think Ortiz has made the bigger impact at welter and will continue to do so.

 

Well I was talking to Timeout until you butted in lol.

But you have things you value when rating a fight, I have things I value when rating a fight. I think personally Ortiz was a good match up, u don't, it is what it is. I think he brought things that made that fight interesting. There weren't many big options out there after Pac. I liked his aggression, size, south paw stance, and fight changing KO power that he brought. Sure I would have liked him to have more big wins then he did, but I also don't see none of the current WWs other then maybe Berto beating him either. He was riding high after his win over Berto mentally feeling confident. I don't think there is any perfect fighter out there and I felt Ortiz brought more positives in the ring then negatives.

 

Valuing a rankking should be based on wins over ranked peers in a division. As I said, Berto had NONE. And that's who Ortiz beat to get his #3 @ WW. Does that actually make sense?

That's fine, but lets call Ortiz what he is. Best of no one else. The ONLY thing he brought was youth and someone for Mexicans to root for on their Independance day.

 

Okay so name me a WW that Margarito beat that did anything of importance at WW when he beat him or even after by 06. He is the only one successfully defending his title because he was never apart of the Hoya, Mosley, Forrest, Mayorga, Spinks, Judah lineage and Baldo lost to Mayweather. Who was Margo facing that was on that level?

 

What's the point? You have google, use it.

But SINCE you asked:
Danny Perez
Andew Lewis
Kerc Kyvelos
Kermit Cintron
Sebastian Lujan
Antonia Diaz
(off the top of my head and memory, but feel free tio research as well)

All Ranked by Ring's top ten before GBP bought it. I never said he was beatng guys ON that level, but what he was doing is beating top ranked WW's. YOU know, what we expect boxers to do and get rewarded for? Have you forgotten that?

Linear isn't any different from most titles these days. Politics and favors have ruined the cred of most titles in this BUSINESS, linear belts included. Boxing isn't run like a sport anymore if you haven't noticed. IT's all business.

He was never a part of those guys because King would not let him fight Judah or Baldomir. Arum TRIED to get those fights made.

 

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That's the thing though, Ortiz and Berto can beat C level guys that are ranked as WWs all day while the division is weak. Margarito got his ranking up due to a weak division that was only top heavy by beating average fighters that were ranked in that weak division. He didn't beat a certain level of fighter to be able to claim he is on that level during this time.

But I can see what your saying he did what he was supposed to do beating who they put in front of him and he had enough wins to get his shot based on what else was out there. But I also think Ortiz could have easily have fought the comp that Margo did and that wouldn't make him more worthy as fighter.

 

Plus guys like Maidana, Cambpell, Peterson, Harris though not WWs were all ranked guys as well. Having some decent fights at a lower weight class helps boost your rating a little bit for the next weight class. Ortiz automatically was a top 10 WW when he entered the division and then beat the #2. Its not like he had to start all over from scratch since he moved to a new weight division.