If Dempsey was as good a fighter as Ali...

It isnt true that all of his weaknesses have to be improved, just that he needs to be given th benefit of the doubt that the skills he displayed in the 20s would still be evident in the 70s. For example,

His Ko Punch is on par with Tysons (as it was against his own time), his abilit to duck and slip and speed of reflex was at the level of Tyson or maybeeven ali. His stamina was probably Frazier level. His chin could be dented but rarely so, Maybe Sonny Liston Level. I think he has the speed of a tyson, was a fast starter, and offensive minded. I think this is what cross trainer is getting at. We dont know if Dempsey is as good as Ali. If he has the same wins and losses as ali when facing Alis opponents as he did when fighting his own (and as impressively), he surely might be. I think this is what cross trainer is getting at.

 

In this case , clearly Dempsey .

 

Here's another nose on that :good

 

Style-wise, Dempsey is custom-made for Ali. Even if they were equal in overall boxing skill just style-wise Dempsey would be fighting an uphill battle against Ali's ring IQ, workrate, footwork, reach and jab.

Ali would win a clear, easy UD and embarrass Dempsey who'd look like a club fighter amateur.

 

Finally a fair and well thought out post,devoid of animosity to a great fighter of the past who probably meant a lot to yours and my ancestors.
He was a creature of his times [the 20s], every bit as much as Clay/Ali,
Frazier [my man],was of their times. Everyone has a perfect right to their
opinions, but not to spout propaganda and distort history to fit their agenda...Cheers:good
B, what would change some opinions of Dempsey ,or Fitz, or Ketchel,would be if we discovered hidden troves of all their knockouts in full color and real speed. Not 5% of their fights,most of which was late in their careers.
What then ? Were our ancestors somehow out of touch with reality ? And did they all walk like Charley Chaplin ? I think not ...

 

Not sure Dempsey gets past Doug Jones, just the type to give him fits

 

Thanks for the compliments, Pete. :good

I realize that this thread hovers around "what if Marciano was 7'11" territory. I think it just avoids it because fighters are so hard to judge objectively from film. Fighters who look terrible at first glance -- like Marciano -- nevertheless manage to grind their opponents into dust. Conversely, boxer-punchers like Herbie Hide or Andrew Golota look great in the gym but get clobbered when real tests come along.

I can therefore easily believe that Dempsey could look exactly like he did in 1920 and still dominate the 1960's heavyweight division. I could also believe that a 1920 Dempsey would get destroyed the 1960's. You don't know how a fighter of that level will perform until he actually enters the ring against his opponents.

A 7'11" Marciano, on the other hand, would unquestionably need to change his style. Among other things...

 

Dempsey was a great fighter who stood out in his era, in the 1970's this great fighter may be an improved version but may also lose the meanness and hardness that came from his era. I think highly of Dempsey and I think he and Ali would cause each other problems. Dempsey was out-boxed by Tunney but Ali was dropped by Henry Cooper and Joe Frazier and I think Dempsey had a better one-punch left hook that Cooper and a few more versions of the hook than Frazier, Jack could throw it long or short (see Jack Sharkey) and it really would be hard to really give you the results but the only thing I can say with certainty is that Ali would not have had a walk in the park with Jack D.

 

Neither did Ali :good , or Henry Cooper also .

 

Dempsey is overrated but was better than Ali d way he was .
What he lacked was 4 things :
1) Ali's size
2) A criminal trainer 2 rescue him whenever coming close 2 getting KOd
3) A criminal promoter 2 control d judges whenever d fight lasted d distance but didn't go his way .
4) testosterone shots


And there u have it .

 

Frank - Please reveal your source regarding Ali getting testosterone shots.

 

Mine ain't exactly minute either :good