If Hatton wins vs Pac, will you rank him ahead of Calzaghe in P4P rank?

An admission of defeat... again. :good

 

Was it unjustified when it happened to Hopkins?

 

All I can do in response is re-post the one you are replying to:


Joe Calzaghe was the best supermiddle in the world 1997-2006, but he didn't prove it and gain p4p respect till he unified v Lacy and Kessler.

Bernard Hopkins was the best middle in the world 1995-2001, but he didn't prove it and gain p4p respect till he unified v Holmes and Trinidad.

Hatton is the best lww but he must prove it before he can be considered an elite fighter.


One win over 3 years ago does not mean he is the undisputed king of the division forevermore. There are other titles to be cleaned up, new fighters to be beaten. Holding The Ring title is good, but it doesn't mean the same as Hopkins reigning and defending the 4 major belts and The Ring title.

 

Am I? Cool. Your incessant need to keep getting me to respond is both dull and a bit weird.

 

That doesn't leave us with a lot of elite fighters in the world to be fair...

Is there anyone at all above LWW under 35 years old who you consider 'elite'?

 

Yes. At the time I would have moved Hopkins up to 2nd behind Jones. Did you think he was better than Jones then? I didn't. However, I felt at the time that Hopkins was a far greater fighter than I feel Hatton is now. Hopkins was better than the De La Hoyas and the Barreras. Is Hatton better than the Marquezs and the Calzaghes? I don't believe he is, nor will be with this one proposed win.

 

No, there is not. That's why they're called the 'elite'.

 

Ok, thanks.

 

Calm down dear. I disagree with YOU. P4P rankings are not linear. If Marquez loses to Diaz, Diaz doesn't go from nowhere to 2nd place. That's not how the p4p rankings work. Why would Diaz beating Marquez at 2 weight divisions above Marquez's natural suddenly mean he is a greater fighter than Calzaghe? It wouldn't. If Hatton beats Pacquiao, I don't believe that one win justifies him being above Pacquiao considering what they've both done over the past couple of years and the weight divisions they have done so at.

 

And again.... Yawn.

 

Ok. In answer to your question, no I didn't consider Hopkins better than Jones.

As you know I am quite comfortable with P4P rankings being a personal subjective opinion and hence try not to get too involved in 'you're wrong', 'no you're wrong' style debates.

I find your arguments on this thread reasinably consistent, but I think if Hatton were to beat Pacquiao decisively then a consensus would emerge for him being number one, as it did for Hopkins. People have short memories.

The fact that something is a consensus doesn't make it right, of course...

 

It's a pleasure to welcome someone with a brain onto this thread amidst the guru's and that other guy who writes in massive letters - if other posters can be bothered wading through their dog**** on this thread they will find some decent arguments and decent reading.

 

I feel the same, I only got dragged into arguments by moronic noobs trolling for fights. Here was my first post from this thread:

"It's a tricky one this. If JMM beats Diaz and Hatton beats Pac, then JMM is the undisputed number 1 IMO. After that it gets very murky. Pac is not really a lww, so should Hatton go above him? Hatton will then have two better wins on his resume than any that Joe Calzaghe has, so shouldn't he go above Joe C? If Hatton does go above Calzaghe then should he also go above Bernard Hopkins? I have real trouble placing Hatton above Hopkins, even this well past-prime Hopkins, as Ricky is clearly a vastly inferior boxer. There are arguments and counter-arguments for each point I have raised in this post. All I know is that JM Marquez will be number 1 if he beats Diaz and Hatton beats Pac. After that, it's anyone's guess. My own inclination would be to move Hatton up to 5th, because I don't believe that a win over a lower-weight/naturally smaller fighter is enough to make him one of boxing's true elite - despite it being one of the best wins of the decade. If Hatton pushes on from that and unifies his division and cleans it out, then he will have made it into elite territoty, but I'm not sure if this one win would do it because right now I view him as borderline top 10. The P4P#1 spot is not linear, it does not work like that. However, I would not argue with anyone who would place Hatton as 2nd behind Marquez, it is a valid opinion, just not one I subscribe to."

 

they're about the same height, pac has a bigger reach, and they will weigh the same. add to this that pac won't be fighting at any lower than 140 from now on. so if hatton beats pac he must go above him. past resume is fair enough when deciding on p4p status but of they're fighting at 140 and that's pacs weight now, then h2h should be used. otherwise pac can fight at 140, lose fights and it doesn't change his status which would be stupid.

 

Well, that proves it then. Why didn't you just say Setanta and ESPN said this on the first page and you would have saved everyone from putting forward their own opinions for 10 or so pages??