If it is true that Evander uses PEDs, then he has no heart. Not in the way you think

I can't be completely certain he took anything like that, so I have to give Holyfield the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps that may be flavoured by admiring him as a fighter so much, but that's my stance.

And no I wouldn't be surprised if an awful lot, maybe the majority of guys were doing the same in that era, can't even rule out Lewis. Or even limit it to that era either, it's not like there was suddenly a big rush on as soon as 1990 clocked in.

 

If Lennox was, then any man who fought him and who wasn't using would have every right to be outraged. If I fought him, I'd fight like the devil to have that loss on my record declared an NC.

 

What if he was just really really good, and could hit phenomenally well and recover well (naturally) ? And he told you so. would you get in the ring ?

 

I dont take that stand.
I think the majority of professionals know that the other guy might be using, and must make a choice as to whether they feel they need to use or not. And it's been going on for decades, it's nothing recent.
The old-timers had quite a casual attitude to such things, drugs and slight cheats. It only becomes an issue when excuses for LOSING are needed.

 

Yes I would. Dealing with a man on the up-and-up is another thing altogether.

Your turn: Would you spar with a man who told you that he was on PEDs?

 

Boxing is inherently dangerous. Drugs that dramatically increase a man's ability to inflict brain damage is not the same as holding and hitting. --Drugs, et al. Let's say that an iron bolt was spotted by the referee dropping from Dempsey's glove after round 2 in the Willard fight. That changes history and Dempsey should have left the ring in handcuffs.

It is surprising that posters take such a casual attitude to PEDs in the ring. There should be far more outrage.

While Floyd's cause has motivations that I find exceedingly suspicious (I think he fears Manny's ability to remove his 0), I wish him success in his campaign against the stuff. Boxing doesn't need it, and more to the point here, boxing fans shouldn't accept it.

 

Quality post, I agree.

 

If I thought I could take him, yeah.

I've known loads of guys on steroids you dont worry one bit.

 

Professionals, Unforgiven, I'm talking about professionals. I've sparred with muscle-heads with arms that look like balloons many times. They don't know what the hell they're doing in there and are stuck in slow motion.

I'd fight anyone, that was my edge, but I'd think twice about stepping into the ring if the guy was carrying a B-A-T or was on a P-E-D.

 

I dont think PEDs are analogous to an iron bolt.

The drugs increase (or can increase) an individual's levels of speed, stamina, strength, perhaps resilience.
But speed, stamina, strength and resilience are not illegals weapons in themselves.
An iron bolt is an illegal weapon.

What's more, the PEDs cant turn fighters who have gone as far as they can as fourth-raters into world champions. They cant turn a naturally slow guy who will never be naturally fast into a Cassius Clay. Improvements are entirely relative to the individual.

I never mentioned holding-and-hitting. But it what way is that more palatable than a guy who might be quicker and stronger through use of drugs ? Holding-and-hitting is an illegal move, like butting. And if one guy plays by the rules and doesn't do it, and the other butts him or hold-hits him into a coma, how is that more palatable to you than PEDs ?

Agreed. I'm all for proper drugs tests if the sport is going to have them at all.
But I'd accept boxing if it wasn't to have any tests at all. PEDs have been around decades, or longer, in boxing.
It was never even considered an issue back in the day.

 

I'm not good enough to spar any decent professional. Again, it boils down to their abilities overall, not what drugs they are (or are not) using.

 

If you've sparred with a top level HW in the last 20 years chances are he was on something. People act like gear is magic, its only an aid to training/nutrition, look at James Toney didn't train hard enough didn't get results. Great training/nutritional science and discipline can outperform someone who takes the PEDs and hasn't got a good progressive training programme. Whats more the steroid/PED user becomes dependant on the PEDs to perform, there only bodies production of hormones shut down so there is no way he can progress once he comes off them, in fact he will likely hit a temporary male menopause losing large amounts of strength, sex drive, stamina

 

This :deal and how hard they spar. Who wouldn't want to spar with Holyfield/Tyson/Vitali if they weren't going to go all out and ruin you?

 

Neither are palatable and that is the point. I'm against cheating and unfair advantages in friggin Monopoly and we all should be adamant about them in the ring.

The plain fact is that PEDs increase "speed, stamina, strength, and perhaps resilience" and therefore increase a fighter's ability to hurt or kill an opponent. Iron bolts are illegal. So aren't PEDs. The reasoning for both is the same.

Perhaps they should have been... that doesn't overcome the point. PEDs are better now and therefore the issue is more dangerous.

Flip Homansky was quoted in an article by Thomas Hauser saying “No fighter should be allowed to gain an unfair advantage over his opponent. PEDs are an artificial aid and no different than tampering with a fighter’s gloves.”

That's about all there is to say.

 

"Abilities overall" to do what? This isn't a juiced Barry Bonds hitting a ball with a bat, this is, as Ruiz said, a fist hitting you in the head.

A whole different ball game.