If Joe Frazier won Thrilla would it have been a bigger win for him than FOTC?

#1 forever............P4P as well. The GOAT with a huge gap behind him.

 

I was referring to round 15 which Borton said he lost. Interestingly he thinks the first two could’ve gone either way but the third one was a blatant robbery.

 

To be fair is it any less realistic than these 11 armed Ali vs 9 feet Tyson threads?

 

Larry Merchant and there are some fans out there who make a case he won the 1st fight. They parrot Ali and his incessant complaining, pulling out the race card to say that Joe only got the decision because of politics.

 

Didn’t you have Bonavena in the lead against Ali?

 

I don't remember ever scoring it. I know Oscar made him look bad and it was a rough nite. Why?

 

Close and competitive against a top contender after 3 years off... no shame imo, still though, without context it looks very odd for "the GOAT" to struggle with Bonavena.

 

Oscar was awkward and strong. The awkwardness is the real culprit. In fairness this is the fight Ali had ringrust. It was probably a blessing in disguise because, without going these tough 15 rounds Ali might get stopped by Joe.

 

No worries Swag, that’s why I addressed round 15 and the fight as a whole.

Tbh, I’ve never heard or read Norton stating that fight 1 could’ve gone either way.

I’ve heard Ken say fight 2 could’ve gone either way - which he officially lost. - for one example, Ken said exactly this in the doco CHAMPIONS FOREVER.

Of course he was awarded the decision in fight 1, so he didn’t have much to say about in regards to whether he won or not. He just said he won the first fight.

He just made comment on the decisions that officially went against him, fight 2 - “either way”, fight 3 “a robbery”.

Not that I think poor Joe could’ve pulled off the second “what if” - viz defending the title and beating Foreman in a rematch but it’s interesting to muse on where that might’ve otherwise placed Frazier.

Beating Ali in the rubber isn’t too much of a leap - particularly since it was fairly close and also if Ali genuinely contemplated quitting after the 14th round.

Winning a Foreman rematch is the only true stretch - but at least it’s just one fight (not a career overhaul) but what a difference it would’ve made!

You wanna see extreme career overhauls or imagined enhancers to a career - look no further than Mike Tyson in the fantasy realm

Even though it didn’t manifest in his own career nor was there necessarily proof of same, many have Mike beating almost every ATG that came before him based on his defeating much lesser opposition - the “hook”’for Mike was that he generally executed his wins over said opposition in devastating fashion.

Giving Joe the Manila fight in the fantasy world isn’t much to ask for in comparison. Even imagining Joe beating Foreman in a rematch, as unlikely as it might’ve been, still falls somewhat short of the many hypotheticals afforded in Iron Mike’s favour.

 

"The two first fights were close, they could have gone either way, but I knew as soon as the bell rang I won the third fight.

https://books.google.com/books?id=6...the bell rang I won the third fight."&f=false

I agree regarding Tyson. But to be fair, I also don't think many ATGs before him were better. I'd only favor Louis, Foreman, Liston, and Ali. Frazier would be interesting if he manages to keep in close.

 

As any sane man would.

 

About as meaningless as the 3rd fight with Norton honestly. I don't put stock in either of those wins It proved what we already knew.