If shavers had managed ed to drop Ali, would he be rated as high as foreman in the 70 s?

No, not even close. Even hurting Ali a few times confirms his immense power.

 

No change whatsoever. Shavers was always known as a huge puncher without much stamina or defense. Knocking Ali down with the power he had would be no huge surprise. The real surprise of that fight was that Shavers lasted 15 rounds. He did so by conserving himself and in turn lost the potential of winning a decision.

 

If he can and did drop Ali like you imagined then you can't say for certain that he couldn't have KOed Ali as well. Maybe the knockdown was so dramatic that Ali couldn't beat the count?

You Ali worshippers can't have it both ways.

 

Every common opponent between them claimed shavers hit harder. In every case shavers performed better or equal to foreman with the exception of their bouts with lyle.

-norton: shavers stopped him 1 round sooner. Norton said he hit harder.

-young: shavers by ko, foreman gets dropped and loses the decision. Young said shavers hit the hardest even over lyle, cooney, etc.

-Ali: shavers goes 15 and rocks Ali hard, Foreman gets stopped in 8. Ali said shavers hit harder.

-leroy caldwell: they both stop him in 2. Whats interesting is Leroy emphatically stated shavers was the hardest puncher he faced and that foreman and lyle were "about the same" but that shavers hit harder than them both put together!

-although holmes didnt fight foreman he said shavers hit harder than everyone he fought including mercer, tyson, cooney, and smith.

-Lyle: emphatically stated in a lengthy interview that shavers hit harder. Shavers dropped lyle in the 2nd but couldnt capitalize and lost by ko in the 6th. Foreman and lyle exchanged kds in a back and forth war with foreman getting the ko. Lyle made a good observation that shavers was a great puncher but not a great "finisher" (theres a difference). Shavers lacked foremans granite chin and killer instinct and thats what made the difference.

Jimmy Ellis said Shavers hit him the hardest. He was koed by shavers.

Roy Williams: shavers was the only man to ko the 6'5 super heavyweight philly fighter.

Joe Bugner fought shavers, lyle, frazier, ali, cooper, and stated shavers hit him the hardest. He said Lyle was a close 2nd.

Randall Cobb, who had one of the most amazing chins at HW (he had only been stopped once in 51 bouts when he was past his prime), praised shavers as the hardest hitter he faced.

You can dismiss these stats, quotes, and observations all you want but its pretty obvious shavers hit harder than foreman and is likely one of the top 10 hitters of all time.

 

I lived all through the Ali era. I cheered AGAINST Ali in every single one of his bouts. I waited patiently for one of the huge punchers of that era to knock him out. Never happened. Ali had a chin of iron and tremendous will to win. Even at a point where he was ripe for the taking Shavers could not do the job. YES Ali was THAT great. Fantastic boxer combined with the toughness of a brawler.

 

And shavers was never able to drop Ali. That is also a proven fact. Yet you can imagine Ali been dropped by Shavers even though it never happened so why is it a certainty for you that Shavers would not be able to finish the job if he did drop Ali based solely on the reasoning that Ali been stopped never happened?

Like I said you can't have it both ways.

 

Big punchers at HW they had stamina problems. A young Foreman,
Morrison and Shavers. The question is Where Shavers be rated if he ko Ali ?
If he did he would of course be rated higher but what would stop Shavers
being rated too highly is that the argument of Ali being way past his prime
would come up. Remember Ali next fight after Shavers was Leon Spinks.
And remember what the press said after Ali lost this fight.

 

What did they say? It was fixed?

 

Leon was 10 - 1 underdog and it was voted Ring 78 Fight of the Year and
the 15 th round the Round of the Year. Leon though was only having his
8th pro fight.

 

No. Foreman ad the extreme destrutction of ATG Frazier on his ledger as well as Norton not to mention a win over Lyle who stopped Shavers. Shavers also had a couple of other losses in there that Foreman didn't.

 

I don't think it would change the way Shavers was looked at. He's viewed as a huge puncher regardless of whether not he was able to drop Ali.

Boxing is unpredictable with things like this anyway. Evander Holyfield watched a long list of heavy handed fighters in his career, and the guy who had him the most hurt from a single shot is John Ruiz (Holyfield was already weakened and tired in the third Bowe fight by the time he went down from that short right hand inside).