If Tyson was in shape for the Douglas fight, he would of knocked him out and if..

Pretty good debate here, until Foremans ***** turned up

I think Tokyo Douglas would have given any Tyson a hard time, however, Tyson himself admitted that he never had anything left, even after knocking him down.
Slightly undertrained probably, but whats missing was the mental edge, he had no desire, no motivation wheeras Douglas came with a will to win. Compare that to the Berbick Tyson, Tyson was hell bent on winning the title, he was willing to do anything to win that night.
Sugar Ray Leonard also commented that Tyson didnt seem to have it that night

Just a funny twist of fate how the Champ turned up and fought like a chump and the chump fought like a champ

an interesting thing to note is that Tyson himself recently commented that the Buster Douglas fight was his best fight ever, what do you lot make of that?

 

Tyson was in-shape,,,,,,,,,,he just had a poor game-plan.
His cornerman were out-of-shape,,
as they forgot to bring a plan.

And Don King,,,,,Mr. Brilliant,, forgot to get Buster Douglass to sign a
future promotional-rights contract.

Looks like the Tyson camp had a bad night,,,,,,,,, across the board.

 

Ive been trying to find the SKY interveiw where he said that. He thinks its his best fight because he showed he could take punishment and come back. And come to think of it i agree, if Tyson would have got schooled that night and then KOd Douglas, people would look at him differently.

Whats missing from Tysons resume, is that backwards-forwards war. Most of the time he demolished his opponents with ease, i think Tyson was lacking that "dance partner" who could give him a serious of good fights. Ali had Frazier, Holyfield had Bowe. The closest thing Tyson had to this was the Bruno fights and the Ruddock fights. Which is why in past interviews he ahs mentioned that the Bruno and Ruddock fights were his best.
Larry Holmes also had the same problem, as do the Klits today, some people are just too good for their opposition, after a while they get looked as "overrated because no one has tested them" while other fighters who have wars tend to be given a higher status.

 

I would like to ask Tyson if he felt he was a better fighter under Kevin Rooney or Aaron Snowell. I dont believe he thinks he was any worse. I also dont believe he knew how good he was before he started sliding, he was that out of touch with reality.
Tyson was a follower either all in, or all out and he went from believing in the whole Cus D Amato mystique and Kevin Rooney, to completely cutting off all ties and going with Don King. He adapted to the people around him. You listen to the early interviews with Tyson about his boxing legacy and its night and day, so whatever he says about his greatest fights its all a bunch of bull**** to cover up how much he ****ed it all up by being a dumbass.

 

At the end you have to remember he was still a young immature thug from Brooklyn, 21 years old millions of dollars and the world at your feet.
I mean only NOW has Tyson actually grown up, these past few years at the age of 45(ish)

Also what Tyson lacked and needed was a guiding father figure, he was a very selfish guy who liked doing things his own way, he needed someone to guide him, first he found Cus, then Jimmy Jacobs, after that he went to King....

 

Rooney was about boxing legacy

King was about maximizing money

Thats the bottom line. The emphasis changed and Tyson didnt need to be at his best to make alot of money win or lose.

 

Tyson had a guiding father figure who took care of him in D'amato who passed it to Jacobs who passed it to Lott and Rooney. He scrapped all that for another father figure who wasnt looking out for his best interest. Its all his fault.

 

Have u seen the Beyond The Glory Documentary?
Tyson talks about King and laughs and says he fed Tyson some made up bull**** about being put in concentration camps etc etc

 

The best Tyson documentary is Fallen Champ, the Untold story of Mike Tyson. Its the most accurate and telling of all of them. You can see how Tyson was programmed to be a fighter and his life was just boxing nothing else.
His marriage to Robin Givens is actually what created the opening for King because he made the alliance with Givens and convinced her Cayton was stealing, so she went to King when she took control of his career.
When they split, Tyson couldnt go back to Cayton and Rooney so he went to King who sold him on control, women and partying. Tyson got tired of curfews and training and sparring six days a week under Rooney and thats why he never went back.

 

The best conmen are great at convincing you they're the nicest guy in the world. For all his faults I'm sure King comes across as very likeable.

 

If any of you oppose stem cell research, perhaps you should examine this post and the many others that Foreman Hook has written over the course of his tenure at ESB and then reevaluate your stance.

You know the thing about is, yes we get the fact that he doesn't like Mike Tyson, fine. But there are other posters that don't like: Rocky Marciano, Jack Dempsey, Roberto Duran, Lennox Lewis, Floyd Mayweather jr, Oscar De la Hoya, Sugar Ray Leonard, Manny Pacquaio etc.

The difference between those posters and Foreman Hook is that they post their opinions; Foreman Hook posts his agenda which is to aggrandize George Foreman at every turn and undermine Mike Tyson at every turn even in threads that have nothing to do with either fighter.

 

If Tyson didn't train properly and wasn't in shape for the fight then that's his own fault. No excuses. Marciano would've trained his ass off if he was fighting his mother. That's what a champion does. Give Douglas credit at least for that one night. He did what he had to do in order to win..Mike didn't.