If Vitlai defeats Sam Peter, where will rate as an all time heavyweight come back.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mendoza, Sep 23, 2008.


  1. Quick Cash

    Quick Cash Well-Known Member Full Member

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    What does it matter if you directed it to Marciano_Frazier? It's still wrong. You're being naively optimistic about Peter's prospects.

    Use your eyes. Walcott was boxing well for his age, and was slightly ahead on the cards at the time of the knockout. I know Maskaev got it together to win the title late into his career, but is he really a fighter known to have blossomed in his old age?

    I already put my opinion out there as to the result of these match-ups. Let's let the rest of the board have its say.


    That's laughable. You're now equating Chris Byrd and old Lewis to Joe Frazier.

    If you're suggesting that Klitschko deserves the same accolades as Ali in his losing efforts against Byrd and Lewis, then it's hopeless for you, my friend.

    Okay, it's 7 years into the future, Vitali is making another comeback after having been injured picking up his morning newspaper. There is a draught in the talent pool so the stage is set; the Ukranian is fighting for the title!

    You're excited.

    You have your popcorn ready.

    Do you seriously believe he gets the championship on his first try?

    Since you're so ****-sure he's 'rusty' now in 2008, he'll be even more rusty come 2015 no matter how many journeymen they feed him!

    Conversely, if, say, the Foreman of the 90's was somehow transported into 2008, don't you think he'll pick up a title?

    Where's the Holyfield to stop him?
     
  2. Quick Cash

    Quick Cash Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Tommy Morrison had the kind of pedigree Peter is sorely lacking. Tommy had Clayton as a manager, and his style was patterned after Tyson.

    Now, I'm not suggesting he was completely successful in his emulation of Tyson, but he was obviously a capable boxer, and he actually had to call on those skills often because his chin was made out of china.

    Foreman was not what you would call a capable boxer, but Sam Peter is something else entirely. It's like someone took George Foreman as a baby and dropped him on his head; that's what I think of Peter's boxing technique.
     
  3. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    The poll needs to be extended down to 4 or 5 so people can have a proper vote. MANY won't rate this an 8.
     
  4. The Kurgan

    The Kurgan Boxing Junkie banned

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    How many boxers get that kind of opportunity? Aside from Jefferies, most boxers don't have the priviledge of an instant title shot the moment they come back.
     
  5. chino1

    chino1 New Member Full Member

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    Vatali Wont Last He Will Give Up Inside Ten Rounds
     
  6. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Yes, Maskaev improved in his mid 30's. I suggest you use your eyes. You'll see better defense, techniqe, and pacing from Maskaev in his mid 30s.

    My point was both were #1 rated guys for a while, and Vitlai took both fights on less than two week notice. These are facts. I did not say Bryd was better than Frazier. You did. I do think Lewis was better than Frazier. Most people would tend to agree. Could Frazier win a match with his left shoulder blow out vs a top ranked guy? Not likely.

    You were the one who gave Ali credit in a losing effort. I think Vitlai deserves as much vs Lewis and Byrd.

    Foreman didn't do so well vs top rated younger guys who could fight and punch. Maybe Foreman would have enough to pick up a belt. Ok--Maybe vs Valuev. But I doubt he'd do it in his first fight back after a long lay off, and I would pick Chagaev, Peter, or Wlad to beat Foreman on his first fight back.
     
  7. amhlilhaus

    amhlilhaus Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I think it'd be huge, with his injuries and not fighting for ages.
     
  8. Quick Cash

    Quick Cash Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Lewis was better than Frazier. Old Lewis wasn't anywhere near prime Frazier. Klitschko lost to old Lewis. Ali lost to prime Frazier.

    Again, it doesn't matter where they were ranked at the time because they weren't fighting in an era where any of the top ten was a viable, strong fighter.

    Klitschko deserves credit for his losing efforts, sure. I was just questioning your insane insistence that he deserves the same kind of credit Ali deserves in his loss to Joe Frazier.

    I said that there isn't anything Klitschko can do to match Ali's performance in the Fight of the Century; very probably there isn't anything he can do to match Ali's performance in his first fight with Quarry. You foolishly disputed that. You want to bet he doesn't look quite as impressive?
     
  9. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    is this a joke? mercer was undefeated top rated olympic gold medalist who had just scored BONECRUSHING knockouts over two top undefeated top contenders damieni and morrison. this was by far a better opponent







    Chagaev is WBA champion UNDEFEATED and has beaten valuev, he is by far the # 2 heavyweight in the world over sam peter.
     
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    No, it is not a joke. Mercer was hot and cold. Understand, after the Holmes fight, Mercer lost to a 18-9 fighter in Ferguson. Than after that, he drew to 7-9-2 fighter in Wilson.
     
  11. SuperSouthpaw

    SuperSouthpaw Member Full Member

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    did maskaev ever beat ezzard charles harold johnson, elmer ray, lee q murray, how bout joe louis? LOL
     
  12. SuperSouthpaw

    SuperSouthpaw Member Full Member

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    Lennox was 37 weighing a career high 257 and was way out of shape. he still TKO'd vitali. like u said, lennox has nothing to lose at 37.
     
  13. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    There was no need to use your other account on this thread, SuzieQ.

    If you want the facts, Lewis took the fight because he signed a contract to meet Vitlai in the ring, and Vitlai was suing. The fight was a fluke, because Johnson was injured and both men happened to be in the same arena on the same night. Understand this is why Lewis took the fight.

    Lewis had the advantage of training for a 12 round match, Vitlai was only scheduled to go ten. Advantage Lewis.

    As it was Vitlai was up 4-2 on all three cards, and I think Lewis was gassed at the end of round six when he nearly collapsed on his stool, but the ring doctor stopped the fight son cuts.

    It was the re-match that Lewis had everything to lose on, which is why he did not take it. Not even, after telling the press, he would and a hefty payday of $15,000,000.00 was on the table for Lewis.


    I also think Vitlai was the best oppoent in his prime that Lewis beat. The Vitlai that Lewis won via cuts was better than the Holyfield, and Tyson that Lewis beat.
     
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Moorer was a blown up Light heavy ,but what was Toney?And Ali was 29 when he fought Frazier M.
     
  15. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Moorer was a blown up heavy. Yes. So was Toney, but I think Toney was nailed with Roids, so perhaps this enhances Peter's win a tad.

    Of Coruse Foreman's win over Moorer was special, but as I said before, Foreman's popularity gave him a 3rd chance at title shot, and he got a title shot coming off a loss to Morrison. It is not as if Foreman was on a winning streak.

    You are right; Ali had just turned 29 when he lost to Frazier. 29 is very young, and still in one's prime. Ali had two warm up fights vs fighters somewhat similar in style to Frazier, and was only 29. Vitlai will be 37, in active for 3.5+ years, and have zero warm up fights.

    If Ali had tried to fight Peter at age 37, he going to lose baldy, perhaps via TKO or KO. Ali's record at age 36+ was 1 win, 3 losses