If Wlad beats Haye he's an ATG

no holmes beat a heavyweight who had retired his claim to the crown. otherwise gene tunney was the man until he dies following that logic.

he didn't become number 2 atsch he beat ruiz and valuev to establish himself at number 3. the number 2 claimed he wouldn't fight the number 1 as I've already proved to you



A promoter’s dream would be to set brother against brother for the undisputed world title.

‘That will never happen,’ says Vitali. ‘We promised our mother we will never fight each other.’

And being true to their word is cemented deep in the education which has been the making of these men.

 

Well, if you're going to use CBZ as a source then please note Wlad's name is MISSING from their list of Lineal HW Champions.

Point, set, match.

thanks for playing...

 

Your earlier post contradicts this post

"Like who?

Dan Rafael?

Don't make me laugh.

That idiot couldn't distinguish **** from shoe polish.

If everyone recognizes Wlad as the champ then please tell me why do the guys over @ The Cyberboxing Zone still have the HW title VACANT? "

 

don't you get it?

that's the point, there is no such thing as a "linear title" lineage is a a concept of the man who beat the man.

the man to begin with is decided by whoever people want it to be. It used to be the NYASC and the NBA, it then became the WBA and then the unification between WBA and WBC. now the only ranking system, that doesn't charge fee's for ranking positions, that awards a belt is the ring

 

How could Chagaev beat Valuev for the #2 spot when Vitali was already the #2 HW in the world?

 

According to whom?

Since when does the Ring Magazine decide who is or who is not a champion?

Forgive me but I never got that memo...

 

That's simple.

Because the title is VACANT...

 

You need to point out exactly where my contradiction is...

 

It was #1 Wlad vs. #3 Chagaev

The Ring recognized the fight to be for the Ring Magazine Championship, but you already knew that didn't you?

If you're looking for a precedent you likely won't find one since there have never been 2 brothers who hold portions of the Heavyweight Championship at the same time. Which , by the way, is another reason why we are witnessing a special time in the history of boxing. You should feel honored you stupid, stubborn son of a *****. :thumbsup

 

Wlad is HW Champion of NOTHING. Deal with it...

 

........................and he has been THE Heavyweight Champion for some time now. Oh yeah, the number 2 guy is his brother Vitali. Hurts doesn't it?

 

Who gives a **** what the Ring Magazine thinks, says, or recognizes?

Like I said, any crediibility they MAY have had went straight to **** on the day they handed Roy Jones jr their 175lb title.

The Ring Magazine does NOT decide who is or who is not a Champion.

When will this sink thru your thick skulls?

 

since they were the only awarders of belts who didn't strip due to politics.

take Hopkins for instance, the ibf decided he was a champ for beating mercado. later stripped the man who beat the man. the wbc decided he was the champ for beating holmes. later stripped the man who beat the man. the wba decided he was a champ for beating tito, later stripped the man who beat the man. the wbo decided he was a champ for beating oscar. later stripped the man who beat the man. the ring decided he was a champ for winning the middleweight tournament after beating tito, the lineage remains intact.

The ring is the only belt which doesn't strip it's champions.

the ring is the only ranking system which recognises all the beltholders.

the ring is the only belt whihc doesn't charge sanctioning fees.

the ring champions at this moment in time are all the "man" in their divisions. the people who beat these "men" will take the ring belt with them until they lose or retire their claim.


as i said, your logic is wholly flawed. When James Jeffries retired he picked who the two guys were that would fight for the world championship, it wasn't a consesnsus 1 v 2. it was the two guys he personally thought were 1 v 2.


don't worry I used to think like you also, but dig around a bit and look at previously recognised world champions, even ignore all the alphabet belts, just look at the lineage and you will see it does not always begin with 1 v 2.

the website you keep quoting (which btw is now out of date incase you haven't noticed) themselves say they follow the man who beats the man.

There is no set rule it has to be 1 v 2. that is the ideal situation but sometimes it is 1 vs retired (Holmes v Ali), 1 vs fringe contender (Robinson v Bell), 1 vs 2 (Moore v Patterson) and sometimes it is also 1 vs 3 (Wlad v Chag,) sometimes it's even been 2 v 3 (Valdez v Briscoe) *of course this is later justified by the scandal invloving Colbert and the ring

This is the point i'm making, when you study boxing history to the extent I have (look at some of the threads I've posted on classic, specifically the resume's post 1930's one) you learn that there is no hard and fast formula.

All the scenario's I listed there created a recognised champion, from that moment you can follow a lineage by tracing victories (which I do believe in by the way, an organisation stripping you does not stop you being a champion in my eyes)

I used to argue this with Cobbler quite a lot and he got me to agree with your line of thinking, but since then i've realised that boxing hasn't worked like that consistently (if it had, then I would agree because it would be like wlad was an exception to the rule)

as I said, noone would dispute them listed names were "the man" maybe an alphabet trinket would but who cares about them. lineage is a concept not a rule.

 

Originally Posted by Nay_Sayer [url]

This content is protected

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Tha's because the Linear title IS THE ONLY TITLE THAT MATTERS. The Alphabet trinkets are MEANINGLESS.



WRONG.
Your earlier post contradicts this post

"Like who?

Dan Rafael?

Don't make me laugh.

That idiot couldn't distinguish **** from shoe polish.

If everyone recognizes Wlad as the champ then please tell me why do the guys over @ The Cyberboxing Zone still have the HW title VACANT? "

 

You're kidding right?

Please tell me you're kidding.

IIRC, the IBO doesn't stip it's beltholders "due to ploitics" either. So, using your logic, Avtandil Khurtsidze is the middleweight champion of the world.

Is that the argument you want to make?