If Wlad's Chin Isn't An Issue....How Does Haye Win?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by BoxingDomain, Jun 25, 2011.


  1. BoxingDomain

    BoxingDomain Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    First, let me start by saying that I do believe Haye is a credible opponent, and he's probably the best Wlad opponent in many years. I also believe that anything can happen in a heavyweight fight.

    Now...let's assume Wladimir's chin is NOT a problem (which I believe to be the case). How does Haye win? I don't think he can outbox Wladimir....

    Why do I believe Wladimir's chin to be a "non issue"?

    Well, as many others point to Wladimir's knockdowns to show how WEAK his chin is, I'm going to do the exact opposite, and point to these knockdowns to show how STRONG his chin is.

    Okay, here we go:

    1. Wladimir has never been KO'd. He's never been laid out flat, and counted out (such as Lewis - Rahman I).

    2. Every time Wladimir has been down, he's got back up. People love to point out the Sanders fight. Well, let's look at that. Sanders hit Wladimir again, and again, and again. And yet Wladimir kept getting up.

    This isn't the sign of a bad chin to me. It's the sign of not knowing what to do in the ring. And let's not forget Peter I, same thing in that fight...Wladimir kept getting up. Again, imo, that's not the sign of a bad chin.

    I maintain that Wladimir's problem was NEVER his ability to physically take a punch, but how he reacted to it. I also believe that over the last several years with Steward, Wladimir has learned exactly what to do should be be knocked down during a fight.

    With that in mind, let's say, hypothetically, that Haye were to knock Wladimir down during their fight. I say Wladmir now knows what do to in that situation, and that he'll simply get up and continue fighting.

    This brings me back to the original question, if Haye cannot KO Wladimir, how does he win?

    (Queue HENDO posting the same hate filled rants and videos over and over again)
     
  2. BoxingDomain

    BoxingDomain Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    That's not how I see it, we can agree to disagree. I see a bad chin as being counted out, completely knocked out, out cold, etc...

    For example, let's say you go up and give it your all, your absolute hardest punch, and knock two guys right in the jaw.
    They both go down. The first guy is completely out of it, and he stays down. The second guy gets back up fairly quickly (within what would be a 10 count). I don't see how you can say the 2nd guy has a bad chin.
     
  3. BoxingDomain

    BoxingDomain Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I can agree with that. I would say it just means he doesn't have an "iron" chin....but doesn't mean he has a bad chin either.
     
  4. shimmy

    shimmy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Well to me there's no doubt the guys that knocked him down could really bang and had proven HW power, something that Haye has not proven.
    I'm seriously doubting that Haye can knock him down or even catch him good enough to stagger him, though its entirely possible.
    I see this as being a one sided ass whooping and this fight will not live up to the hype, it would be almost impossible for it to. We'd have to see what neither of these guys I believe is capable of, and thats an all out war for many rounds of back and forth action and changes in momentum. I just can't see that. Patterns tell the future almost everytime.
    So what I expect to see is more of the same. Wlad will break down Haye slowly and either stop him or take and easy UD.
    If I'm wrong I have no problem admitting it, its just the way I see it now.
     
  5. MickeyBlueEyess

    MickeyBlueEyess Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Alot of it is to do with Wlad panicking when he gets hit, his legs go, i think he's better now in that respect but then again imo he hasnt fought anyone with the speed, power and accuracy that Haye has and i see Wlad crumbling once more.

    Also Haye has never been knocked out cold either so i guess his chin isnt that bad either going by your logic?
     
  6. BoxingDomain

    BoxingDomain Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Never said it was. :good
     
  7. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    Even if Wlad had a decent chin Haye would still have a chance of getting a KO. Valuev and Ruiz showed a level of durability throughout their respective careers yet Haye was able to badly hurt Valuev and drop and stop Ruiz.
     
  8. LancsTerrible

    LancsTerrible Different Forms of Game. Full Member

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    I'd disagree about you on Wladimir's chin not being a problem but for the purposes of your argument lets say it isn't a problem. Now Haye is an explosive puncher, maybe not the hardest heavyweight puncher but he has explosive punching power and he has stopped all heavyweight competition aside from Valuev thus far, so his power is proven above 200 pounds. Even if Wladimir has an average chin or even a good chin you don't want to be getting hit too often by a big puncher because no one is some sort of invulnerable. For me even the hardest of chins can be bypassed by precise, constant hard shots. If Haye can get around the right hand then he has the ability to land precise constant hard punches.
     
  9. mughalmirza786

    mughalmirza786 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Another issue is that I don't believe Haye has the power of those other guys. Who has he starched at HW exactly. Wlad holds several 1 punch clean ko's.
     
  10. buckdacious

    buckdacious Sin~City punks!!! Full Member

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    speed, haye will win with speed and accurate punching. I cant remeber the last time Wald fought somebody that didnt just stand in front of him. nobody has gave him movement
     
  11. madballster

    madballster Loyal Member Full Member

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    If you look at Wlad's previous knockdowns you'll see that he partly loses control of his legs. He's on shaky legs and therefore vulnerable for repeat knockdowns.

    The key for Wlad - after a knockdown - will be to hug and tie down Haye in order to regain control of his legs.
     
  12. BoxingDomain

    BoxingDomain Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think Haye has power, no doubt. But on the flip side, it did take him 9 rounds to get rid of an old Ruiz. Something that Tua did in 19 seconds 14-years earlier.
     
  13. doylexxx

    doylexxx Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    What about the punch that didnt even land that had Wladamir crawling, thats a weak ass chin if air knocked him down right there, address that please !!
     
  14. klimting

    klimting ???? Full Member

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    hear hear.
     
  15. doylexxx

    doylexxx Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    the ruiz that haye fought had matured and had a lot of world class experience since then and had been a champion , tahts not a fair comparison look at all the top fighters jahnny fought , why couldnt they ko him ?

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