If YOU were Joe Calzaghe, would you come out of retirement to fight Andre Ward?

Hopkins pulled out because of the terms of the offer not because he was avoiding Calzaghe

No
HBO wanted that fight

1: Bradley was always planning to move up which is why he fought Abregu at ww
2: Pacquiao fights in America

Calzaghe was basically unknown in America until he fought Lacy back in 06
It should be pointed out that even then American fans never warmed to him

****** never made one offer to Jones.

In order for him to do that he would of needed the green light from HBO. Show me one article where a member of HBo says that talks are in place or any offers have been made?

 

He made numerous offers to Daruisz including asking him to share a double header to generate interest for the fight and Dariusz refused.

He never pulled out of the Calzaghe fight. He pulled out of the Hakkar fight, and then Showtime withdrew their offer

Collins also called out Jones and Dibella said he would not ok that fight because no one knew who Collins was. Interest would have to pick up before he would allow such a fight. Calzaghe refused to fight in America he wouldn't even promote his fights in America, which is why Showtime reduced his purses

Calzaghe had his chance back in 99 and he said himself said did not want to fight Jones. The Dariusz M fight was much easier for Calzaghe to make and he looked the other way. Just like he looked the other way at the Pavlik fight

He never made ANY offers

 

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Boxing%3A+I%27m+lord+of+the+Welsh+rings+says+Calzaghe.-a060444934

 

Andre Ward

 

the answer is no. joe retired like he was suppose to and thats after he did what he wanted to do in the sport. hopkins and jones jr were in joe's era and beat them.ward and the rest of those guys are in a new era and only fantasy matches should be made in your head were you predict the outcome. joe is older and passed his prime and i would only fight ward in my prime. ward would beat him in us i dont know how they would call it in the uk. but ward is a better fighter and boxer the joe thats a fact.

 

Its no fact at all its your opinion simples....

 

Mind Reader,

Hi mate, can you give me and Bailey your honest opinion, regarding how well known Joe was in the U.S. during his career?

Many Thanks!

Loudon.

 

Ah, well, that's not a fact because that can only be proven if Ward beat Calzaghe when they were both at the top of their game.

You can make the case that Ward has had a much stronger start to his career than Calzaghe, and you can argue that his resume is stronger overall - taking into account the nobodies Calzaghe fought to balance against the former world champions and Hopkins - but that's about it.

Calzaghe would have beaten everyone Ward's beaten, while I'm not sure that - at this point in his career - the same could be said in reverse because Ward has yet to face anyone with the skills of the 2008 version of Hopkins. Other than Hopkins, Ward would probably beat everyone on Calzaghe's resume (though I'm sure even the declining Eubank would give him a difficult time).

The only thing that can be said with utter certainty is that Ward is the best Super Middleweight of the current era, of the post-Calzaghe era and can be ranked along side the best in the divisions history.

 

Part 2.

I've read your link, and what does it say exactly? It says Frank was going to New York for discussions, and that's it. Roy's representatives probably also had brief discussions with Tarver's team aswell, around the same time.

Once again, Joe was just a possibility, until Murad had a definite answer on Ruiz. As soon Roy got the green light, Joe was dismissed. But in your world, that was a duck right?

His choices were,

To fight for a version of the heavyweight title.

To fight Tarver in a grudge fight, at his weight.

To fight Joe, who was relatively unknown, who fought at a different weight.

You SHOW ME where Roy confirms that Joe was chasing him for 5 or 6 years. He said "I know he's wanted to fight me for a while" That doesn't PROVE that Joe chased him for 5 or 6 years!

All he did, was mention Roy's name. What did he do after? Did he move up, or go to America? NO! He continued to fight at 168 in Britain.

If you think that is chasing a fight, then you're crazy!

My answer is, you need to go and see your GP.

You don't use logic, or take circumstances into consideration when you have these debates.

Joe Calzaghe in 2001, was nobody to Roy Jones and his team. He was also, a nobody to HBO, and to the American fight fans.

He mentioned Roy's name, and then did nothing.


Try and put yourself in Roy's shoes, and see things from his perspective.

In 2001, he was trying to get a fight with DM, and was under pressure from fans to try and make the Hopkins rematch. He was the unified 175 champ.

Do you seriously think, that Roy at the time, would have given a seconds thought to Joe's comments after he'd beaten McIntyre?

The fact that Joe didn't fight at 175, or in America, speakes volumes! That fact shows me just how serious he was. He was going up in 2001, but he didn't get there. In 2004, he himself said, I know I have to move up. Barry McGuigan in the same year, said he's got to move up at this point. He didn't get there til 2008!

Haha! It'd got Roy's favourite icing on. If Collins and Joe had've known the recipe, Roy might have fought them both for free. He loves his cake!

That's IRRELEVANT! We're not talking about Roy's opponents. We're talking about Joe's! Frazier was a mandatory at 175. Joe fought at 168.

For the millionth time, beating Brewer and Jiminez, at a weight divison below, wasn't going to get people interested in a Roy Jones fight at 175. If you can't see that, you're stupid!

A ridiculous comparison!

Joe was relatively unknown, and fought in a different weight class.

Roy was considered the best fighter on the planet, and was the unified 175 champ!

DM would have got his opportunity, but he wouldn't go to America for the fight.

Why?

I said he wasn't going to get a shot at Roy by continuing to fight at home at 168.

Ok then, Britain, or the U.K.

You really don't get it do you.

He needed to put groundwork in like Ricky, or he needed DM's belt to tempt Roy into the fight.

We're going around in circles, like the vicious circle Joe found himself in.

Roy wasn't interested in 2002, because Joe wouldn't have been a big fight.


HOWEVER,

if Joe had have gone to the U.S. earlier, and made a name for himself, and put in good performances, then they might have have been interest in the fight. If fans had've wanted to have seen the fight, if there'd been a big demand, it would have been a more attractive proposition for Roy and HBO.

Likewise if, and it's a big if, but If, Joe could have taken DM's belt, then Roy would have wanted to have fought Joe to have all of the belts. Roy wanted to fight DM, he just wasn't prepared to go to Germany because he said things like "I don't think a knockout would guarantee me a win over there."

If Joe had've been an attractive proposition to Roy, HBO, and the general American public, then things would have been different.

Joe wanted to fight Roy for big money, which was fair enough, but he wasn't prepared to do the groundwork like Ricky Hatton.


So to summarize, what you're saying is, if Joe had've been guaranteed really good money, he'd have been willing to go to the U.S. and fight Roy.

That's what you're saying.

I can agree with that.

HOWEVER, he was never going to be guaranteed to get a shot at Roy for good money.

BECAUSE, he wasn't known enough at the time. He was stuck in a vicious circle, like the one I'm in with you.

If he'd have gone to America in 1999, when De Bella had opened the door for him, things may have turned out very different. But as you know, at the time of De Bella's offer, he said he wasn't chasing Roy, or wanting tough fights.

 

Part 3.

DM didn't want the fight! If he'd have gone to America, he COULD have had the fight.

It doesn't solidify a thing!

DM called Roy out in The Ring Mag?

He wouldn't go to America for the fight!

He never went!


You're a complete idiot!

You know King wanted a 3 fight option on Roy.

You know Eubank didn't want big fights.

Collins hadn't fought in ages, he didn't have a belt, and HBO didn't want the fight.


He dismissed Collins, to fight Reggie Johnson to UNIFY the titles.

Why would he have wanted to fight Collins, when he had the opportunity to fight a better fighter to unify the division? Think about it!

He wasn't known ENOUGH, to make a fight with Roy, a big fight.

Why do you keep mentioning Grant every thread??

Grant was happy to fight at 175.

Joe was going to go up in 2001, but he didn't.

He was then going to go up in 2004, again he didn't.

He didn't go up til 2008.


He had to fight Manfredo to gain U.S. exposure in the penultimate year of his career!

You can believe whatever you want.

He wasn't known ENOUGH to make it a big fight, for big money.

OMFG!

Grant fought Roy at 175!

Frazier and Woods were MANDATORIES AT 175!

JOE FOUGHT AT 168!!

Again, you can believe what you want to believe. If you read the comment in full, with him talking about his capabilites, it's safe to assume, that he was talking about a lot of money.

If you think it was under a million, that's fine. Let's leave it now, we've discussed it to death.

Never needed to???????

Ha! HOW THE **** WAS HE GOING TO GET A ROY JONES FIGHT FOR THE CROWN JEWELS, without going to America, and fighting in Roy's weight class????

Why would Roy have wanted it at the time?

Joe was a nobody in the world of boxing, outside of Europe in 2002.

Clueless!

The above quote from you, shows everybody on this forum, that you haven't got a CLUE WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!

I don't think I can add anything else to this ridiculous quote!


Regards, Loudon.