IF Jack Johnson had fought Sam Langford in December 1910 ,5 months after beating Jeffries who would win? NB That year Langford was scaling between166lbs and170lbs. IF Bob Fitzsimmons had been the same age as Jeffries,[there was 12 years between them,]and the same weight,[there was39lbs and 47lbs disparity in their two fights.] Who would have won? IF Ray Robinson had fought Joey Maxim in December of 1952 instead of June of that year, who would have won? IF Muhammad Ali had not been barred from earning his living for three and a half years and, after koing Folley in 1967 he had continued to defend his title who would have defeated and dethroned him and when? IF Number 4 ranked Sonny Liston had fought Floyd Patterson instead of number 8 Brian London would Liston have won the title? If Liston had been successful in the previous scenario, and defended against Johansson who would have won? IF After koing Firpo,in September 1923 Dempsey had defended against Harry Wills in February 1924,who would have won? IF Tom Sharkey had been not 5'8" tall and 187lbs,but 6 foot tall,and 200lbs, would he have beaten Jeffries? IF Lennox Lewis had fought Riddick Bowe in92/93 ,who would have won? IF John Conteh had fought Victor Galindez in74/75.who would have won?
1. Johnson 2. Fitz 3. Robinson 4. Ken Norton 1973 5. Liston wins and also beats Ingo 6. Undecided 7. Possibly. Sharkey gave Jeffries trouble as it was. 8. Lennox. Big guys with poor defense were always sitting ducks for him. 9. Haven’t seen enough of Conteh to say.
1. Johnson 2. Fitz 3. Robinson 4. Joe Frazier in either 1969 or 1970 5. Liston wins both 6. Dempsey 7. Hmmm, I'm going Jeffries but not confidently 8. Lewis 9. Galindez, but it would have been close and controversial
Johnson was in his prime in 1910, or close to it, so the answer is Johnson. Fitz, all day. Jeffries was a musclebound oaf. Robinson, all day. Ali: no one could have defeated him in 67-70 had he continued to train. Liston and Liston. Dempsey. Easily. Wills is legend on this site, but not in reality. Yes; Jeffries was STILL an oaf. Lewis all day. Possibly.
Lennox was not the seasoned fighter of the late 90's and had many weaknesses whereas Bowe with Futch was a superb h2h nightmare. Bowe wins by late TKO in a titanic king king vs Godzilla affair. But Lennox wins the rematch.
In regards to Ali I think that he would have lost to Frazier roughly around the time it actually happened. Eddie Futch was moving Joe along to peak around 69-70. Ali may have had more ring miles on his odometer without the layoff. More importantly Ali would have underestimated Joe in their first encounter. Eddie Futch knew just how to exploit Ali flaws and Frazier was the perfect style to make it work.
In December of '52 Sugar Ray cruises to a lopsided decision win and becomes the light heavyweight champion. Then he goes on to defeat Marciano for the Heavyweight Title.
IF Jack Johnson had fought Sam Langford in December 1910 ,5 months after beating Jeffries who would win? Johnson IF Bob Fitzsimmons had been the same age as Jeffries,[there was 12 years between them,]and the same weight,[there was39lbs and 47lbs disparity in their two fights.] Who would have won? IF Ray Robinson had fought Joey Maxim in December of 1952 instead of June of that year, who would have won? Maxim loses belt catches diabetes from too much Sugar! IF Muhammad Ali had not been barred from earning his living for three and a half years and, after koing Folley in 1967 he had continued to defend his title who would have defeated and dethroned him and when? Breaks Marciano's record and runs into father time -since he fought until 1981.. this version fights (1984-1987) Tossup IMO Mike Spinks win in similar fashion as with Holmes loss to him. That Clay/Ali we saw had an arsenal that consisted of a body attack, defensive wise he bobbed, weaved got under shots or deflected so he continues honing those skills...Since he fought till 1981, I think he does an Archie Moore and fights into his 40s. If He could fight till 45? Tyson drops him several times and the ref or Ali's corner protects their fighter. IF Number 4 ranked Sonny Liston had fought Floyd Patterson instead of number 8 Brian London would Liston have won the title? Yes If Liston had been successful in the previous scenario, and defended against Johansson who would have won? Liston IF After koing Firpo,in September 1923 Dempsey had defended against Harry Wills in February 1924,who would have won? Dempsey by controversial decision. IF Tom Sharkey had been not 5'8" tall and 187lbs,but 6 foot tall,and 200lbs, would he have beaten Jeffries? Probably not, but I'm guessing. IF Lennox Lewis had fought Riddick Bowe in92/93 ,who would have won? Bowe. Lennox was crude in 1993- it showed against Bruno that he outlasted him. Whereas Bowe was at his peak. With no Manny Steward for Lennox, got to tip it to Riddick by decision. IF John Conteh had fought Victor Galindez in74/75.who would have won?
IF? Johnson pulled out of a signed contract to meet Langford in 1909. A clear duck. Sam's manger tired to make a match. Johnson had no interest. Langford was not an old washed up man, nor was he a short type of fighter with limited skills. In a 20 round match Langford is taking Johnson out. I mean Johnson says he was hurt by Ketchel, lost to Hart, and was actually stung by Ross of all people, not to mentioned knocked silly in 1909 vs. a very green Gunboat Smith in a 4 round exhibition match. Langford IMO hit harder than all of these guys, was more skilled, and was also stronger in a clinch. Fitz best wins were in his later 30s, you can look it up. Being younger would not have helped him; he needed a better chin to beat Jeffries. Robinson lost partly due to the heat. A change in venue and he wins. Frazier, in the late 1960's would have beaten Ali. Liston is beating either Ingo or Patterson Both Dempsey and Wills slipped by 1924. I'd side with Dempsey as Wills just did not look good on film. Sharkey's wild bulldog style suited his height. He didn't have the skills to beat Jeffries, even if he was 6 feet tall. Judging on the Olympic gold medal match, Lewis landed too quickly on Bowe. However, 92-93 was Bowe's best year, and Lewis took longer to develop. 60/40 for Lewis as Bowe just did not have good defense. Conteh is a little overrated on this board. I think Galindez, who was at his best in 74-75 would take the decision.
Johnson signed to fight Langford in October 1908 ,2 months before he became champion,I've told you this several times.As champion he thought he was entitled to more than the £3000 the N S C were willing to pay. Can you confine yourself to answering the hypothetical questions posed please ? We dont want another anti- Johnson rant from you, if we required one we can look back through your posts and choose from the several hundred you have posted. Langford at 5'7" wasn't short? FYI In 1910 Langford was between 166, and170lbs he also dropped a decision to Jim Flynn that year. Fitz was 12 years older and 39 & 47 lbs lighter for the Jeffries fights,the next day sports pages ,after the second Jeffries fight declared had he been the same age and size as Jeffries he would have won. Dempsey, had he fought Wills in Feb 1924 would only have been 5 months from having taken out Firpo in2 rds.Since Dempsey did not fight in 1924 there is absolutely no basis for stating he," had slipped". Sharkey was conceding27lbs and 4 inches of height to Jeffries and ran him very close,I think its fair to suggest that with added weight and height he may have done appreciably better.
Johnson wins a decision. Fitzsimmons. I've always thought that Maxim benefited from the conditions, at the time of their fight. Robinson was the superior boxer and I think would have beaten Maxim in more clement conditions. I think Frazier was ready for Ali from '68 onwards. The result of the first clash was close anyway and might well have swung the other way on any other night - but, Frazier is still the one to eventually dethrone Ali, in my opinion. Yes. Liston. I'd have taken a punt on Wills. Maybe Sharkey takes this with an extra stone in weight. I've always thought Lennox had Bowe's number. Conteh.
