Ike Ibeabuchi vs Joe Frazier

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Jay1990, Mar 10, 2019.



  1. sauhund II

    sauhund II Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Let me repeat myself here for the 1020754th time........Frazier is 1-5 in his signature fights , stopped three times , two times in complete un competitive fashion.......Foreman literally bounced him around like a little kid and ate Frazier left hook like it was nothing.

    Take the rose colored glasses off .........his come right at you "smoking" is getting him ko'ed against both Ike or Tua......... he simply does not have the chin for big elite bangers or the defense otherwise his face would not have looked like a moon crater after each top level fight he was ever involved in.

    I would say Frazier is tailor made for those 2, both like to trade up close , Ike sets it up a little better with the jab but again both like to fight fire with fire except Frazier fire is a little candle and not quite good enough.
     
  2. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Let me repeat myself Ike is 0-0 in his signature fights....I know he is newer and that shiny things fascinate people, but he never even got to the level of a signature fight. But go for it, the newer is better crowd has an opening if you want to sign up
     
  3. young griffo

    young griffo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I never said that Frazier walks through Ibeabuchi but don't let that get in the way of a good strawman rant.

    Running through former and future champions in seconds??

    He beat a green Ruiz (who went on to win a world title at least, which Tua never could achieve) and a washed up Michael Moorer. Big deal. Don't pretend like he blasted out anyone worthwhile there. Rahman was whipping him before he caught him late and still benefited from a gift stoppage and later a gift draw against him. When he had the chance to really prove himself and achieve something he failed every time. Lewis dominated him and Tua basically turned it up and Byrd beat him clearly. Exaggerating things much lol?

    It's OK. Plenty of people were fooled by Tua at the time. Big punching, fearsome looking etc It's just that most people now realise that he wasn't as good as advertised and Ibeabuchi beating him isn't in anyway indicative of how he'd fair against a better and more talented fighter like Frazier.
     
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  4. young griffo

    young griffo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Their power isn't overrated but their h2h capabilities often are.

    Same as with Tua.
     
  5. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    There was only one George Foreman. Saying Ike hit as hard as Foreman is quite a leap. Foreman brought much more than just a heavy punch. Yes he had a big jab but it was his intensity and murderous rage that he unleashed on his opponent. Especially those early rounds. When he had you hurt is where George was uncommon.
     
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  6. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    You should have stopped at bigger and stronger. Joe was just as quick and every bit if not more skilled in his style of fighting. He was perpetual motion moving in and his inside punching was precise.

    Its questionable whether Ike hit as hard Joe. Too small of a sample size.
     
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  7. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Not here for the fairy tales Full Member

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    Then it seems you weren't paying attention to the conversation that you decided to sarcastically butt in on. I specifically referenced Ibeabuchi surviving a record-breaking 12-round slugfest with Tua in response to another poster's ridiculous question about why we should assume that Frazier wouldn't blast Ibeabuchi out inside of two rounds.

    And you can discredit the versions of Ruiz and (especially) Moorer that Tua fought all you want but the fact remains that very, very few heavyweights have multiple 30-second blowouts against heavyweights who were ever world-class. If you don't think those performances demonstrated that Tua had truly exceptional punching power then I don't know what (or if) you're watching. You seem to be referencing fights where he landed very few flush punches on his opponents as somehow proving that he didn't really have exceptional punching power. I assume you don't really mean that?

    You're fighting strawmen and you seem to be confusing discussions of Tua's punching power with discussions of his overall effectiveness as a fighter. Nobody in this forum thinks that Tua was some kind of unbeatable monster. But Ibeabuchi is the only person who more or less stood his ground and slugged it out with a prime, motivated Tua for 12 rounds. That performance leads me to believe that he could endure anything Frazier hit him with, and I'm not convinced that Frazier could withstand hundreds of punches from Ibeabuchi.
     
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  8. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Not here for the fairy tales Full Member

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    Yeah but Forum Frazier is impossible to hit cleanly unless you have Ali's speed or Foreman's strength and special uppercut.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
  9. young griffo

    young griffo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I probably wasn’t paying attention because I’ve heard all this talk about Tua/Ike before and it’s just overblown to all proportion. This wasn’t some era or career defining win but merely one promising fighter beating another in a good, close fight. The fact Ibeabuchi’s career was cut short subsequently had added a status to it that it doesn’t deserve in reality as neither fighter went on to achieve anything at the highest level. That’s it. I don’t see what bearing it has on Ibeabuchi/Frazier fight other than the vaguest of resemblances between Tua and Frazier’s stature and style.

    Tua was clearly powerful. He was also limited, one dimensional, inconsistent and as much an unfulfilled talent as Ike. Power alone doesn’t cut it against the top guys which is why Tua achieved what he did and the likes of Frazier and Tyson achieved what they did.

    As for Ike we still don’t know how his power stacks up at the top level. It looked huge against Byrd obviously but looked less than amazing against in his penultimate fight with Everton Davis. If he’d stepped in with a Lewis, Holyfield, Golota, Grant, Akinwande,Tyson, McCall, Mercer etc then we’d have much clearer picture.
    Hence I’m backing the known elite, world class quantity in Frazier by UD.
     
  10. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Absolutely perfect. This is the reality.
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    So do you now retract this and agree Tua had top end power?
    "Ahh the God like thunder of David Tua’s power. The same God like thunder that mysteriously dissipated whenever he fought someone who wasn’t green, washed up or plain sh1t."
     
  12. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Tua was the ranking number 8 heavyweight ,he wasn't some promising newcomer.
     
  13. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    They conected a lot of times yes. And it was very entertaining. But not only is it visibly evident that there was not a mark on either of them but also that it was a clear case of quantity over quality of power. Ike has even said himself he should have sat down on his punches more in this fight. He has said he wasn’t hitting hard enough. If this does not underline it I don’t know what will.

    Douglas was spearing Tyson with full blooded blows after buying a feint. Punches he could not anticipate and took solidly all night. These were not scuffing punches between two men frantically exchanging together who a lot of the time had not enough time to set themselves and load up. One guy was catching and one guy was pitching. It is completely and utterly different to the Tua and Ibeabuchi fight.

    As much as you want to believe there was something super human about Tua and Ike 280 and 332 heavyweight punches landed will always leave clear visible impressions even if only a percentage of them are the very hardest solid clean blows.

    no I don’t know Evolution from ghost town boxing. Never heard of him. Unusual Christian name I’ll give him that.

    it was a draining fight and both exerted themselves under hot TV lights. Sun stroke can give you a headache. But if it was punches that caused the headache maybe you need to know It is Not unusual for any fighter to have a headache after every fight and sparring session. Boxing is not a tickling contest.. Also, I would like to know more about any surgery Ike really had and why he was licensed to box afte this if he had.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
  14. SheenLantern

    SheenLantern New Member Full Member

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    Joe gonna go to prison for the whupping he puts on Ike.
     
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  15. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Both were comfortably inside the top 10, Byrd wasn't far off top 5. I find your comments inconsistent with your views and judgments of contenders from earlier decades.
     

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