I'm not a guy for modern threads in Classic but...

Im a big Martinez fan and had him beating Williams i believe i had it 115-112 Martinez,but i think Mayweather would probably beat him.

 

I like your choice of words here 'conservative genius' and i agree with your description. He wouldnt take the Martinez fight unless he really fancied his chances bigtime and if he won (which really wouldnt surprise me) then he does deserve the plaudits that would come his way from most (not all). I cant see the fight happening though before Pacquaio. In fact i wouldnt be surprised that if he beat Pacquaio, then Martinez would be his last before retiement (again). So to answer your question in a nutshell then ,Yes, it means hes the real article

 

If there are any constraints on what Martinez can weigh (up to 160), then even if Floyd wins, he can't properly be considered MW champion, any more than SRL was ever LT HWT champ.

(I have argued essentially the same point when Pac faced Cotto and wanted a catch weight, AND the title. Nothing wrong with catchweights but not for titles).

Regardless of what the sanctioning bodies say, there would, at a minimum, be an asterix beside the event.

On this point, I posted the following in the general forum:


http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=231172


I personally see a serious case for Martinez being a better notch on Floyd's belt than Pac.


And more than a year ago, I posted a thread arguing that Floyd should consider fighting Pavlik for the MW title, if he was interested in establishing himself as being in the same general league as SRR, Armstrong etc. which he himself apparently believes to be the case.

I reckoned that to be a pick'em event , with a slight edge in favour of Floyd.



Martinez made my point regarding the over-ratedness of Kelly.


So now to the "if Mayeather annexes the MW belts...what does that mean?" bit. It means that Floyd has an elite (by the standards of the current pack) MW on his resume, and is 'THE MAN" at 160.

I believe future historians would put more stock in that achievement than beating a much smaller (former 112 lb champ) ATG in Pac. Both Mosley and DLH will probably be ranked higher as Welters than Pac, and Floyd already has both names, even if not the best version of either one. He is EXPECTED to beat Pac at 147.

Not necessarily so for Martinez AT 160.


Of course ,it has to be at 160.

154.5 or anything else less than 160, and much of the shine is lost.

 

Even though Martinez is not a particularly big or physically fearsome middleweight, it would still be a stellar achievement for a guy who started at superfeather to beat him. I mean, Oscar tried to do this but he was facing a vastly superior mw in B-Hop, so he came up short. Martinez is the right opponent for Floyd to achieve this I think. He does not have the power to stop Floyd, and he does not have the skills to outbox Floyd. Martinez's game is built on athleticism, and Floyd is faster than him and at least as athletic.

 

Martinez would decision Floyd .... I cannot imagine Floyd taking the fight ...

 

It would be a great win and I honestly think he'd beat him. As Popkins said, Martinez relies on his athleticism but Floyd beats him in that department imo.

 

Martinez would be a tougher fight than Pac, Im sure of it. Hes bigger than you guys think.

 

Looks set to explode soon though. Golovkin, N'Dam N'Jikam, Macklin, Pirog are all hitting the world stage now. Hopefully Guerrero, Lemieux, Korobov, Jacobs, Proksa, McEwan etc will be there in the not to distant future. Although obviously the chances are a few of those might not make it, or will move up/down.

 

This idea of Mayweather Jr. taking on Martinez sounds interesting. If Floyd could actually win that match and take the titles I'd totally buy into his ability.

I guess my problem is that Mayweather is a guy of Leonard's caliber (not entirely only in this metaphor) and no Duran, Hearns, or Hagler to fight.

 

Mayweather is not faster than Martinez at this stage of his career - especially with his legs, and legs are the key.

 

He's not much bigger than Oscar, and Floyd coped well with Oscar. In fact Oscar is more physical than Maravila, so I can't see size being quite the issue it should be with a fight between a welter and a middle. Martinez is bigger and stronger, but I believe Floyd is tough enough and skilled enough to beat him.

 

Floyd may not be able to beat Martinez in a 100m sprint, but his mind, his hands, his reflexes are all faster and sharper. Floyd's counters are lightning-fast and laser-accurate, and Martinez does not have a great defence or a great technical base. Martinez doesn't have the power to knock Floyd out. Floyd will outbox him, his skillset is too far ahead of Maravila's. I really like Martinez, think he's a cracking fighter, but stylistically this fight is extremely winnable for PBF.

 

Hmm, are they? I think Mayweather's been steadily declining in that department, and he hasn't shown any evidence of being on top sharpness since 2007.

Technically Floyd is better, yes. But he's up against serious physical disadvantages in height and reach as well as speed, coupled with the doubly unorthodox of Martinez as a southpaw and one who throws some of the weirdest combinations of anyone in the game right now. It's difficult to counter that kind of package unless you're really sharp. Mayweather doesn't have the great legs he did in the lower weights, and I think he may be a bit of a sitting duck for a bigger guy to pepper him and move.

 

Really? :huh I thought he looked as fast as he ever has at 147 in both the Marquez and Mosley fights. Shane didn't even know where the punches were coming from, he was having right hands bounced off his skull before he had time to anticipate the blow. And Marquez could not close the gap and land shots because Floyd's reflexes were razor-sharp.

He lost 1 round out of 24 in those 2 fights, and you think he looked sharper when he lost a few rounds to Oscar and 1 or 2 to Ricky Hatton??

I disagree that Martinez has an advantage in speed. Remember, it's one thing looking fast against a sluggish, drained 178lbs Kelly Pavlik, but it's quite another looking fast against a quick, slick, superbly conditioned athlete like the welterweight Floyd.

100% Floyd will find Martinez easier to hit than Martinez will find Floyd.

 

Can you imagine Oscar fighting in the same way with Kelly Pavlik? No, he got pushed around by Felix Sturm.