Impressive conservative displays from generally non-conservative fighters?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Jan 3, 2012.


  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I was thinking about Ali-Foley which is kind of a weird fight anyway, but Ali was really quite conservative in this one. He stayed off his toes and stationary for long spells of the fight, he didn't throw a lot of punches at all, he boxed for small advantages, and when Folley invaded his space (Which he did skillfully and inch by inch) he often boxed carefully rather than moving off or flashing. When he did move it was in a generally more relaxed fashion and there was nothing so wasteful as the Ali-shuffle or anything like that.

    A tiny part of this may be explained by his mood which was sombre where he is also usually flashy, but he also spoke at length before the fight, and mentioned right after the fight how clever the veteran Folley seemed to be. I think he feared a trap, or being tricked by a fighter who outweighed him so significantly in experience. There may have been a teeny weeny hex there.

    He also spoke about Folley's decision not to (or inability to) come to him, meaning he had to "slow down and box at his pace." This may actually have been the trick Ali feared, ironically, but anyway. Even after he really hurt and dropped Folley he didn't leap on his man or attack and nor did he do so in the following round, and when he does build his attack he does so, shock horror, off a pretty technical foundation-type jab, a solid, workmanlike punch bred for accuracy and form rather than variety and speed.

    But it was an impressive display none the less and some point to it as Ali's peak display.

    Any others like this? A volume puncher who curbs his output due to some clever counter-punchers technical advantage, a puncher turning box-puncher to protect his chin, a fighter who likes to lead turned tactical?
     
  2. Guyfawkes

    Guyfawkes Than who was phone?! Full Member

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    Frazier turned really conservative and careful in his second fight with Forman
     
  3. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    I thought Roberto Duran fought somewhat conservatively in his rubber match with DeJesus..he avoided getting decked early again and fought a somewhat more disciplined, purposeful fight and thoroughly proved his point..
     
  4. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Julian Jackson versus Thomas Tate put him in a different light.
     
  5. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    Much of Hearns - Leonard, both ways to some degree.
     
  6. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    Hearns - Benitez, Hearns had to reign himself in greatly, especially when it came to firstly following Benitez to the ropes, and wailing away there.

    Spinks largely shelved the big right hand vs Braxton/Qawi due to his superb countering.
     
  7. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Great call JT1..:thumbsup
     
  8. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Nice post. I watched Ali-Folley the other day having not seen it for quite some time and it's a good choice to kick things off.

    Cobra mentioned Duran-DeJesus III, but the respect that Duran showed to Hector Thompson was particularly unusual for him and probably a more efficient way of gaining the stoppage than going nuts to the wall would've been. Hector was like an articulated lorry at lightweight in terms of his size and strength, so Duran broke him down on the back foot and only really started to snarl a bit once he had Thompson hurt.

    I like Ortiz' performance against Old Bones in winning the title, he was very tempered and inversely clever in the way he went about it, outfoxing the fox rather than banking too much on his youth and physical advantages. His jab, timing and subtle shifts of movement were all top notch and he still kept up a good workrate without deviating too much from what he set out to do.

    Conservative might not be the most exclusively appropriate term, but Harada was warier than usual in the rematch against Medel with the title at stake - unsurprising when you look at how Medel timed and trapped him first time around just when Harada thought he was starting to have it all his own way. Great fight from both men this one with Harada showing his versatility and the quality of his jab in particular. Medel was a very good trapsmith and a crafty ******* off of the ropes as well as having knockout power in both fists, but Harada didn't bite nearly as much. He sometimes did similar stuff against Jofre actually; that knockout loss to Medel really helped in making him a better, more multi-faceted fighter when all was said and done.

    I have to mention Morales-Pacquiao too, final round aside. It's become a bit of an irritating cliche that Morales had underrated boxing skills, but he really took note of what Marquez had done and reigned himself in superbly here despite not giving an inch of ground in the exchanges; it was actually Pac who was forced to do that most of the time, though usually from being off balance. He went toe to toe just enough to let Pacquaio know that he wasn't going to take any **** but was generally disciplined and never let Pacquaio get fully set when the latter was in the phase of transitioning himself; his timing and straight punching at mid to long range were spot on. And he was past his peak too, by this point.

    Oh, and yeah. Hatton against Tackie and Malignaggi :cool:
     
  9. horst

    horst Guest

    Barrera vs Hamed. At the time, no-one expected MAB to be able to box in such a disciplined and effective fashion.
     
  10. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    One of my all time favorite displays of disciplined and effective skill.:good
     
  11. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Would Froch-Abraham fall into this category? I never expected Frochy to be so disciplined.
     
  12. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Just remembered Walker-Hudkins II. Great role reversal for Mickey, that one.
     
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Obviously because he'd been all knocked about in the first one?

    Which punches do you think he ditched, and what do you think he was looking to replace them with in terms of winning strategy?

    What point was that? You felt he boxed out of respect to DeJesus's power?
     
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    What light? What were the core differences and why do you think he made the changes?

    What affect do you think they had on one another to cause this? What made them want to box differently?
     
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Good call. Do you think it was voluntary or was it forced? You think it was pre-planned?