In defence of Jess Willard and Primo Carnera

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There is plenty of flim on Willard vs. Moran. Willard looks a little better on flim vs. Moran than he did in the early rounds vs. Jack Johnson, but he's far from a good boxer.

 

Mendoza--I have to disagee that the modern superheavyweights have been more dominant than old champions.

Lewis--41-2-1 (32 ko''s) (2 ko'd by)

Vitali--43-2 (40 ko's) (2 ko'd by)

Wlad--56-3 (49 ko's) (3 ko'd by)

Totals:

140-7-1 (121 ko's) (7 ko'd by)
----------------------------------------------------------

Joe louis 68-3 (54 ko's) (2 ko'd by) (1 LD)
Rocky Mariciano 49-0 (43 kos)
Sonny Liston 50-4 (39 ko's) (3 ko'd by) (1 LD)

Total 167-7 (136 ko's) (5 ko'd by) (2 LD)

Winning percentage
Lewis & Klitschkos--94.6%

Old-timers--96%
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Ko percentage
Lewis & Klitschkos--81.7%

Old-timers--78.2%
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Ko'd by percentage
Lewis & Klitschkos--4.7%

Old-timers--2.8%
--------------------------------

The old-timers stack up pretty well.

 

true but he was talking about super heavyweights.

to be fair, we'd have to compare the records of carnera, willard and maybe fred fulton

 

You have a point.

But there is also another point.

Willard, Fulton, and Carnera were not the dominant fighters of their eras that Lewis and the Klitschkos are today.

My take is that it is therefore somewhat of an apples and oranges comparision.

But the men who actually were dominate champions in the old days stack up pretty well with Lewis and the Klitschkos, and so I am not quite certain what point Mendoza is making other than the big guys are better than the little guys of today, but weren't in the past.

**Also, unlike Lewis and the Klitschkos, Willard and Carnera were not just big, they were the biggest good fighters of their eras. Valuev is the best comparision in the last decade.

 

I would pick Bronco Billy Wright over Willard.

 

These guys are destine to greatness.

 

An overdue thread!

Big Jess Willard was doing the right thing against Dempsey: jab, jab, grab, spin, smother, jab, right hand. The Pottawatomie Giant may well have coasted to victory that day over his dwarfed challenger, á la either Klitschko over a Chambers, a Briggs, a Haye.

Except for one thing: Explosives in Toledo! The Mauler's awesome left hook to the jaw marked the lusty beginning of a merciless demolition. Willard's neat game plan went kerblooey as he ran into a monster.

As did Carnera's.

Da Preem resembled the Klitschkos in fighting Louis. He fought like a big man should, behind the jab. No matter. The Bomber got through to him like a knife through butter.

Yes, this pair of giants were brought down to size by all-time greats, but either I'm seeing things or they certifiably show some decent skills on film.

Today, the Klitschkos--carefully put-together champions--are not so unlucky as to have to meet such great fighters as Dempsey or Louis. So, shine on, oh siblings!

But give Jess or Primo today a year or two to acclimate and, in a heavyweight scene that lacks giant killers, they will be a force to reckon with in the early 21st century.

 

One did.

 

i have to agree with most of this..

The thing that set Carnera and Willard apart from others in their respective eras was their unusual size, and sometimes that wasn't enough.. In latter periods in the sport it took more than just being bigger than everyone else. Lewis and the Klits would not have lasted as long as they did on size alone. They were more well rounded than the giants of 70 + years ago, and with a complete package of top conditioning, punching power, sound boxing ability, etc.. They also had to prove their abilities against other fighters who either matched or came close to matching them in size, something that Willard and Carnera rarely did. Claiming that Carnera beat a big tomato can in Ray Impellittiere, doesn't convince me that he showed he could beat a gifted big man..

 

There have been plenty of big men around ,both before ,and after Wiillard and Carnera,,if it was just their size that won them success ,surely they would all have made it to the top?
The same can be said of both the Klits, which gifted big men have they beaten?

 

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...0kEAAAAIBAJ&pg=1494,2658139&dq=jeffries&hl=en

Apparently, according to Jim Corbett, he was surprised in person at just how fast Jess Willard was. You would hardly expect say Muhammed Ali to be surprised about this when he viewed Vitali or Wlad. I wonder if it is possible that Willard might be one of the quicker boxers if he was around today.

If so, it would create an interesting challenge for some of todays superheavys and certainly change the complexion of the way you would expect him to go.

 

Absolutely.

The knockout punch on old Artha' was a swift, lethal missile.

Such a blow on Wlad's chin would not be nice.

 

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Carnera scores a knockout over the giant slugger from Argentina Victorio Campolo:

[DM]xlfmgh_primo-carnera-ko_sport[/DM]