Roy’s style was underpinned and built around incredible speed, reflexes and timing. Once that all disappeared, the whole system quickly collapsed. But, let’s remember, Jones was 34 when he lost cleanly to Tarver (after a fight he initially won). That’s getting on for a fighter, let alone one who relies on speed and reflexes. He was pretty close to the average retirement age when Tarver first beat him and I think the long length of his post 2004 career often masks that. But I digress. My point really is that I often see posts, in fantasy match ups etc, which instantly dismiss Jones as being ‘chinny.’ But I really don’t see any evidence of this until late into his career, as an 'old man.' In his prime years - or anywhere close - he was dropped once, a flash knockdown against Lou Del Valle. And that was it. Some people say he didn’t face punchers. But I saw him take plenty of full, clean whacks (albeit not routinely) - without issue - against the likes of Tarver (1), Toney, Hopkins etc … even from Ruiz up at heavyweight who was a big, strong, solid guy. I’m not saying Roy had a chin of iron. That wasn't borne out once he got older. But I think it was perfectly respectable during his prime years, and deteriorated quickly... along with the rest of his skills. We all get old. And people forget that Jones was into his mid-late 30s when this issue starting arising. The counter argument is that he always had a weak jaw but was so good in his prime years he never got hit … even that criticism (though it’s not accurate) is a compliment!! Respectful thoughts and observations welcome.
That, and Roy's father pushed him physically from an early age. The man ought to have had a shorter athletic prime.
I understand the point you're trying to make but I can say I barely saw Roy take any flush shots his entire career until he started to get hit ... and when he started to get hit he really went out in frightening ways .. forget Tarver, then Johnson and others that followed , it was brutally , horrifically fascinating to see ... once the reflexes went, ....
What was he, a rock solid 195 or something for Ruiz? To strip 20 pounds of muscle off his body after that was absolute suicide and his punch resistance fell off a cliff almost straight away. I never noticed his legs wobble between 160 and 175 before that, including the knockdown he suffered against Del Valle.
Great analysis, Ali was too fast in his early career but was dropped on 2 occasions All Boxers are entitled to get old Jones had a decade as the best Boxer in the world, that says it all It’s petty to criticisms him when past his best Just picking faults for the sake of it No one judges Ali for his performances against Spinks, Holmes and Berbick Boxers primes is how they should be ranked There’s never been a Boxer like Roy Jones jr Boxing is hit and don’t get hit and Jones was the best, untouchable in that decade of dominance
I don't think the knockdown vs Del Valle was a flash knockdown Jones was clearly buzzed by it, and he held on and went back towards to ropes as Del Valle went on the attack. I'm not saying Jones was in any real trouble but he needed to see out round to get his faculties back together.
A fair point, though he was up quickly and I don't recall him being in any serious danger of being knocked out. My point is it was of course a very different scenario to whenever he was dropped later in his career. He either didn't get up or you knew the end was coming. There was never that sense of vulnerability when he was younger. As an aside, after rewatching some of Roy's old fights recently, I thought the worst I saw him perform was the Glen Johnson fight. I'd actually forgotten how bad he looked in that one. Even though he got KO 'd more quickly in other bouts, he just looked dreadful; slow, hittable, lethargic, back constantly on the ropes. You knew he was completely done at top level after that. It's amazing - and sad - that he was just beginning his 'second ' career at that point (one good, one bad), carrying on for another 15 or so years.
In his prime Roy very rarely got hit flush. He was always chinny. It just showed more when his reflexed slowed down due to age.
I completely agree about it being a terrible match up. A real head scratcher … matching a past his best legend, with a recent tendency to get knocked out, against a prime, big punching guy near the top of his division - and abroad to boot. I have no idea why Roy - and / or his team - took that one. I remember when the fight was announced thinking it would only go one way… While I agree it was a very bad knockout, my point was that I thought Roy looked at his worst in the Johnson fight, overall - even though he was knocked out worse in other bouts (Lebedev and probably Macarrinelli). He actually looked better than I expected him to in this fight. No problems if you don’t agree, just wanted to clarify.
Thanks for your response. If Roy was chinny all along (and I don’t agree with this assessment, though I respect your opinion), logically that would mean he was SO good that it was never exposed - in almost 15 years as a pro, many of those at the top level and against other ATGs. That’s quite impressive, no?!! In a sport where the object is to punch your opponent. Surely his chin would have been exposed earlier??
[QUOTE="KO_King, post: 22809259, member: [/QUOTE] This is a repost, but I think it’s relevant: Regarded as a once-in-a-lifetime talent and unfortunate victim of one of the most blatant corruption scandals in Olympics history, he was seen by many as second to only Sugar Ray Robinson as the perfect fighting specimen. But as Roy’s career went on, he began turning many hardcore fans off with a cushy HBO contract, speaking of himself in the 3rd person, making a petty rap song against the fans that wanted the “old” Roy back, coasting to 120 / 108 scorecards against hopeless “mandatories” and culminating with a cherry-pick of the most unworthy heavyweight titlist in boxing. So when Roy got KTFO by one punch in the Tarver rematch, and then brutally ragdolled by a journeyman in his next fight, many fans said it was karma for his hubris. Now, there’s a couple of generations of boxing fans who consider him a china-chinned fraud who ducked big fights in order to play the sanctioning bodies games and Roy really has no one to blame for that but himself.