Ingemar Johansen vs Cleveland Williams

Ring Magazine

 

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...04fAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jdEEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3496,2688770

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...=6UIyAAAAIBAJ&sjid=PuYFAAAAIBAJ&pg=6047,68226


http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...3dPAAAAIBAJ&sjid=NQUEAAAAIBAJ&pg=1757,4984750

Looks like there was going to be a 3rd match between Terrell and Williams for the vacant WBA title in 1964...Then Williams got shot and hospitalized. Too bad, Williams might have been a champion.

 

I am going to look into this tomorrow and search through my collection of 1961 magazines. The annual ratings for year ending 1961 do not include Alex for good reason he lost 5 times that year - 4 by stoppage- against two wins. The fighters Alex beat the year he lost to Williams were losing streak Alonzo Johnson in March and some guy in August called Jimmy McCarter who was 9-3. McCarter never won again. Alonzo and McCarter were in all probability not rated. Miteff ended the previous year 1960 with a loss to H.Cooper right after a brutal loss to machen so any ranking Alex had left then went to Cooper. I can't imagine the Alonzo win gave Alex a rating because Alonzo was 2-4 in his last 6. Still stranger things have happened, I will try to keep an open mind.:good

 

I really dont see any significant wins in Big Cats resume that would compare to Ingo while Ingo has some good wins over Patterson and Machen. Unless Ingo froze because of the big muscled body of Big Cat I would lean with Ingo by a stoppage

 

So basically Ingo suffered the most brutal KO in history for a fighter that lived and fought again is your point ? A KO in a class by itself ? :roll: Can we be serious please. He got KO'ed. IT was brutal. The fighters I mentioned suffered brutal KO's as well ...

 

In the NBA ratings for period ending August 1961 Alex miteff is ABSENT from the top ten. Boxing illustrated top ten rankings also have miteff ABSENT for the same period. The most recent fighters to beat miteff in the run up to this period are however all rated.

Bob cleroux #7, Chuvalo #6, Williams #5, machen #3, Cooper #1 in the NBA ratings. The same winners over miteff were rated#9 chuvalo, #8 cleroux, #7 Williams, #5 Cooper, machen #3 with boxing illustrated. Liston having been removed from #1 with the NBA because of his suspension in Pennsylvania.

Naturaly the fighters miteff beat (Alonzo Johnson and McCarter) were not rated with either the NBA nor boxing illustrated.

I shall look at more magazines to try and find a 1961 miteff rating.

Alex is rated in a October 1960 ring magazine at #7 for period ending August 60' even after the brutal loss to machen. However, I need to look through more 1961 books..

 

Once again,

Ring Magazine ranked Alex Miteff # 7 heavyweight in the world going into his fight with Cleveland Williams. Stop denying this. I have provided you with many sources.

 

That's not a promising sign for an era when a guy like Miteff can back door his way nearly into the top 5.

 

"Can we be serious please."

I seriously disagree with you. Concussions can indeed cause neurological damage, and sometimes death.

A better line of criticism might be that I personally really don't know about Johansson, but a concussion (and he was out for more than five minutes) is certainly a serious matter which could cause greater susceptibility to future concussions.

 

So Suzy says...so far I have found a 1960 magazine that rates miteff #7 but crucially not a 1961 magazine ....yet. I have more magazines to look through. You never know Suzy could be right but I doubt it. Maybe miteff retained a rating for his gate keeping losses? If you beat him you got #9 slot.

 

What about the sources he has provided?
Ingo caught Machen cold and would never rematch him,though Machen desperately tried for the fight, if they fought again I would pick Machen .
I'm not sure Ingo would have beat other contenders like Folley either.
Ingo lost 2 out of three to Floyd, being kod in both, talk about Williams resume, well Ingos isnt deep is it?


http://www.eastsideboxing.com/weblog/news.php?p=18354&more=1

 

Crazy as it seems Miteff was indeed number 7 in the May Ring rankings
1-Liston
2-Machen
3-Folley
4-Cooper
5-Johansson
6-Chuvalo
7-Miteff
8-DeJohn
9-McNeeley
10-Cleroux

 

:happy