Ingemar Johansson vs Sonny Liston 1959

You were literally using Williams' failure to stop Daniels to criticize his power.

That's literally all I've been saying this entire thread.

It's Chok and Bah Lance who are using these disingenuous comparisons, literally all thread.

Terrell fought a Williams with damaged hands that many included myself, scored against him. Also if that fight had gone, even another two rounds I doubt Terrell goes the distance, he was all but ready to go in that last round.

Holman was not past it. He was just number 3 the previous year and involved for the tournament of Rocky's title. He retired because of the brutal KO loss he suffered at the hands of Williams. He was unconscious for more than three minutes.

Miteff was 25... and coming off a very controversial SD hometown loss to Chuvalo by HALF a point.

Alonzo Johnson was 26.., had just gave a very respectable performance against Muhammad Ali less than a year prior, and was knocked

Roger Rischer was number 9 in the ring ratings, and dropped out days before his fight with Williams under odd circumstances despite not having a fight. Gregorio Peralta had just beaten light heavyweight champ Willie Pastrano, and to make room in the ratings, Rischer was booted and Spencer (who was number 10) remained. Very likely a mistake. Rischer would go on to beat Cooper, Powell, and Mcmurray.

Untrue. Miteff was 7.

Miteff was green in the bout, having turned pro just a year prior.

Hunter was at the end of his career, and coming off a lackluster performance, losing to an obscure name before coming from behind to get the win, and never won again.

Williams didn't have a chance to face those fighters (except Miteff who he also stopped). Williams had a much better record that Dejohn against common opponents who lost to three men who failed to defeat Williams.

Their's a shock. I doubt anyone here (except Chok of course) would favor Dejohn over Williams.

 

He had been knocked out the previous month! Clearly not fit to fight anyone. Today he wouldn't have been allowed to fight. The extent to which you are ready to bend the facts to fit your agenda is mind-boggling.

 

And got creamed in just one round by Brian London…who iced Richer with a whopping right hand moments after the first bell.

 

Also Eduardo Corletti, who was ranked 9th at the time.

 

That was a good win. Corletti beat Chuvalo yet Chuvalos next fight was against the world champion. Another example of Contenders who operated in America losing fights and still keeping a ranking or in this case getting title fights.

 

Relax. I'm already sold on London's power after he concussed and retired your boy.

 

He was knocked out by rated Alex Miteff in a back and forth fight where Miteff was nearly finished.

All you and Chok have been doing are bending facts to fit your agenda, like your laughable way of crediting Ingo for victories over, ever rated opponents, even if they weren't ranked when Ingo beat them, but Williams doesn't get the same luxury.

 

Forgot to provide my source regarding Liston admitting he was knocked down. Article clipped from Daily News-Post - Newspapers.com Please don't ask for it again five pages down the line or so, as I'm getting rather tired of doing this.

 

That was actually quite funny

 

Isn't it strange that Liston first says that Williams almost knocked him out to later say that he wasn't even staggered when Williams hit him?

 

I can agree that the Cooper win is looking less impressive because of the losses he had immediately before the fight. A win over Cooper may look more impressive today than it did at the time but as he was knocked out by mediocre guys in the fights before, Ingo's win is not more impressive than that of Bates and Bygraves.
What I find more impressive about Johansson is that he didn't slip up even once against any of those guys (although nearly in his final fight but final fights usually don't count). Very few boxers fight the same guys and up with only 2 losses against Floyd, even if you only include champs.

 

Cheers mate.

 

I found a couple of Sonny Liston interviews before the first Ali fight on you tube. The first is by Jim Jacobs. Here are my highlights:

Jacobs--"You've been quoted as saying Cleveland Williams hit you harder than any other fighter. Is that true?"

Liston--"Well, I would say I think so."

Jacobs--"Can you recall anything that happened in that fight that would stand out in your memory?"

Liston--"Well, like the only thing I can remember is that Cleveland had a good first round and a terrible second round."

Jacobs--"What was the good first round like?"

Liston--"Well, it was only--it was a lot of doubt in people's mind was I gonna answer the bell for the second."

Jacobs--"And eventually what happened in the second round?"

Liston--"Well, I gave him a little of his own medicine back and he couldn't take it."
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and on the upcoming Ali fight:

Jacobs--"Cassius Clay said you were 45 years old and you don't belong in the same ring with him."

Liston--"I imagine I don't because I'm just that much better than him."

Jacobs--"Some of the things Cassius Clay has been saying, for example, yesterday he said when Liston fights Cassius the Great everyone will complement him for falling in eight. Do you have anything to say about that?"

Liston--"The only thing I can say don't get your tickets late. If they're waiting, oh, its only in the first round they might miss it."

Jacobs--"Do you think it will end in two?"

Liston--"Well, you can bet your life it ain't going four."

 

The second interview is by Max Goldman. It was after the JFK assassination, as they mentioned it, but before Liston was to begin training on December 27:

Goldman--"Do you think the Clay fight will go beyond one round?"

Liston--"Well, I can say it won't go over three."

Goldman--"What about the heavyweight picture in general? Who do you see around that might be a worthy challenger after you and Clay meet, assuming you defeat Clay?"

Liston--"Well, I think Terrell is about the third, I think. I don't know where Machen is standing now."

Later,
Liston--"There's no heavyweight around to prove how good I am."

Goldman--"When did you first sense that you would become the heavyweight champion of the world?"

Liston--"When I fought Cleveland Williams in Miami."

Goldman--"How long ago was that?"

Liston--"About five years."

Goldman--"How did that fight end? It was a knockout for you?"

Liston--"Yes."

Goldman--"What round?"

Liston--"Third round."

Goldman--"What made you think when you were through with the fight five years ago that you were the next champion?"

Liston--"Well, the way he could hit and he punched hard and after the fight we went back in the dressing room and all the reporters came in and said now we believe you can take it."

Liston--"I looked at his record and he had a string of knockouts. Before I fought him I said to myself these are nothing but setups, and after the first round I went back to my corner and I told my trainer they weren't setups because he knocked those guys out."

Goldman--"Whom do you consider to be the toughest fighter you've ever met?"

Liston--"I would say Cleveland Williams and I imagine Zora Folley. The Folley fight was one of my best fights."