Is Bernard Hopkins an ATG?

I'd say the limit for a ATG is about 50th, ever. Hopkins is about 70th on my list, so just misses out on it.

But mate, people are saying Calzaghe isn't an ATG for the same reasons I don't think Hopkins is. The difference is, Calzaghe, like Pryor eariler in the thread, beat the best and was ducked. Hopkins was beaten by the best two fighters he faced and ducked people.

And like I said, if you take away the losses to Taylor on the basis of age, you have to put aside the wins over Wright and Tarver.

Hopkins did dominate, sure, but there is a lot ofother middleweights who, in his shoes, would have had the same or more success.

Head to head is another thread entirely, but will say I absolutely rate his abilities. Although, head to head is mythical and largely irrelevant when it comes to ratings the best fighters in history. Rating ATG's has to be judged on facts, which H2H isn't.

What exactly is there in his resume to put him ahead of either Robinson, Greb or Monzon? If he is ranked 1-3 he has to be above one of them. Then there is people like Hagler, who he also doesn't beat as far as resume goes.

And I seen his career. Don't say I'm ignorant to Hopkins because I don't rate him. If you read my post, I praise his dominance over B class fighters, but that is exactly what they are, B class, and dominance over them isn't enough.

And where is he ranked at 160lbs? Nowhere.

And Miranda and Mugabi were shite. Neither of those rank highly at all.

Hall of Famer at 157lbs, sure. If the IBHOF put people in on their weightclass, Tito wouldn't be given any thought in a middleweight class. ABC beltholder who beat nobody.

Same as Tito. De La Hoya doesn't rank ANYWHERE at middleweight.

So? Hopkins beat him badly, but it's William Joppy. Not a great win, becaue he doesn't rank highly.

Taylor beat him twice, despite being "good".

Tarver isn't borderline. He is a decent fighter who got lucky in beating Jones.

If Hopkins had beaten him then, I wouldn't have the opinion that I do, but he didn't. He beat him in 2007 over 20lbs above Winky's prime weight. Wright isn't a noteworthy light heavyweight. Where does he rank? Nowhere.

I made this point a while ago, but you must have missed it. The fact is, the lighter fighters Hagler beat are a class above the light fighters Hopkins did.

And still a bigger threat than anyone on Hopkins' resume. He also had wins over Bobo a short time before, so he obviously wasn't shot.

I hate this type of response.

 

So he has a better record than Greb, Monzon or Robinson?

I don't think he has a resume worth of him being a top 10 middleweight.