Is Duran an overrated lightweight?

Next to Benny Leonard their is no other fighter to reign as champion at lightweight for such a long period. He may not have defeated as many HOF calibre opponents as Leonard but he beat some very quality fighters and is clearly top 3 lightweight with only Ike Williams having a case behind Leonard.

 

Ive always had Benny Leonard above Duran at 135.

 

I think this is the perception of a lot of people, that Duran's achievements above 135 and past his prime ensure him the #1 spot at 135.

I think this raises the question, how much should a fighter's achievements above a certain weight affect his ranking at the lower weight? Is it possible that the fighter improved in any areas (i.e: strength, experience) when moving up in weight? In Duran's case, I think his chin got better as he moved up in weight - he was dropped twice by DeJesus at 135, but by the time he got to 160 he seemed unfloorable.

I also think the reverse logic may be true, that there are things that happened above 135 that could be counted against him as a LW - specifically, the "No mas" incident could be used to question his mental toughness at any time heading into that fight. I certainly would question any notion that Duran could become frustrated enough to quit only at 147, but was mentally unflappable above and below that weight.

 

Interesting reads.

Like I said, the perception of Duran as the "undisputed" #1 all-time LW was based mainly on his subsequent success above the weight and was not a contemporary view while he was still at the weight (although he was generally considered one of the all-time best LWs before moving up).

By contrast, fighters like Robinson and Pep were already considered arguably the best ever at their respective weight classes while they were still active in those weights.

 

What do you think about Eleta managing his extended reign at LW by having him defend against top 10 - Top Ten for christ sakes - lightweights only 50% of the time over the duration?

 

No ****? You're telling me that some old motheaten fogies picked dead end kids over a guy who was ultra modern at the time? I've never heard of such a thing...

 

The 'current era' always seems to be the nadir of the sport's history. :yep

 

Not disputing the qualifications of Benny Leonard or Ike Williams in any way -- their resumes speak for themselves -- but these experts talking about how long an overmatched opponent lasted (especiallly a runner) obviously didn't do their homework and see if the same was true of Leonard or Williams, because it was.

Both guys won multiple decisions over lesser fighters -- and in Williams' case also lost fights to guys who weren't exactly all-time greats while champ.

Again, doesn't distract from their greatness, but to criticize Duran for not knocking out some crafty survivor types (and skillful ones at that (ask Alexis Arguello how easy Vilomar Fernandez was) and not point out that the other guys also went the distance with some so-so opponents in their lightweight primes is disingenuous.

 

I rank Leonard above, Williams below.

Its a deep goddamn division.

 

The deepest. The most pound-for-pound greats and even a top-twenty-and-beyond consisting of fighters who seem like they should be top ten material.

The division is so stacked that you can't even fit top ten 'locks' into the top ten.

 

I'm sure I've said it before but you can't have him number one solely on resume. Although taking everything up to Dejesus III (and admittedly that is stretching the definition of 'lightweight') he is clearly top 10.

 

Granted, it wasn't a particularly deep pool past the top few guys anyway and he beat who he needed to, but literally anyone in the top ten is better than... Not top ten? The Cervantes fight Eleta balked at would've been nice. Easy to understand why, but we don't have to like it.

 

Duran beat Leonard, what victory in Sweet peas resume is greater than that? find one and I will rate Pea over Duran, find another lightweight with a greater victory on their resume. Find me a gassed past it old guy past prime who beats a Barkly and a Moore type oponent and we can begin to discuss wether Duran is overrated

 

I think he's rated high because alot of people just love watching him

 

I agree. Many times "experts'" opinions are disappointing in their narrow focus. The analysis on this site is often much more thoughtful.

As stated above, anybody's record can be knocked. In these "experts'" case, I simply conclude they resisted placing the current top-dog over revered icons. And they may have been right, though not for the reasons expressed.

Duran's win over Leonard must be considered. It proved Duran could whip (in Leonard) an all-time great with top-shelf speed, a welterweight punch, and the ambition, heart and determination to turn back other all-time greats such as Hearns and Hagler.

On the other hand, a top boxer like Benny Leonard or Joe Gans could frustrate and outpoint Duran.