is Duran overrated as a lightweight? quality of opposition?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Unforgiven, Aug 4, 2017.


  1. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Were these fights all at lightweight?
    135 ?
    I suppose we can stretch to 138 to be ultra generous, because in assessing Duran's lightweight record we need his lightweight fights.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2017
  2. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    The thing is his lightweight resume and reign is great but the division is so stacked historically I can't see how his exploits at lightweight put him so high so regularly.
    Compared to the lightweights if the 1930s to 1950s for example, or 20s to 60s even, he seems to have an awful lot of padding in there.
    There are guys at 135 you'll never see in an all time top 10 here who arguably have more quality in their resumes, and considering how convinced people are that Duran is a lock for top 2 or 3 at the weight, that's remarkable.
     
  3. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    I'm not questioning Duran's prowess or his greatness. I'm questioning his routinely high placement against other great lightweights.

    Forget the lightweights of today. Duran is supposedly great enough (and I believe so) to be compared against great lightweights of the old eras.
    Throw him in the 1930s or 1940s and match him like those guys were matched, or compare resumes.

    Buchanan, he fought ONCE. Once.
    Look at the likes of Ike Williams, Tony Canzoneri, Lou Ambers, Sammy Mandell, Barney Ross, Beau Jack, Bob Montgomery, Henry Armstrong, Willie Joyce, whoever.
    Some of these guys are barely remembered. They were fighting other ATGS or exceptional challengers often, multiple times.
     
  4. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Yeah I like the fact that he fought often.
    It's fine to have filler on the record. I'm just wondering about his BEST WINS AT LIGHTWEIGHT.
    It seems to be lacking, relative to the history of the division.
    Maybe I do need to dig deeper.
     
  5. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Lou Bizzarro ? Was he any good ?

    I wasn't impresed with Vilomar Fernandez. He might have win over Arguello but he has an unimpressive record around that.

    Those two look weak challengers to me. On paper, and in the ring.
    And Duran managed to make long work of them.
     
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  6. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Did you guys live through that era? Most of the lightweights Duran fought as champion had excellent reputations and were very well known.
     
  7. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Hill benefitted from the multiple title opportunities and the watered down talent pool of his era. As a fighter he was nothing compared with Duran. Hill could not carry Durans jockstrap in terms of ability.
     
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  8. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Chavez did? Who? Who did Chavez fight at 130 better than Marcel: Lockridge, LaPorte, Mayweather? Who did he fight at 135 better than Buchanan: old Ramirez, shot Bazooka, Rosario? I don't think so.
     
  9. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Just because he was fighting for a long time doesn't mean he wasn't past it. That's just crazy. By the time he permanently moved out of 147, he was past it and had had over 70 fights. He was completely hit or miss above 147. I mean he lost to Kirkland Laing ffs. You claiming Laing is an atg better than Duran? Size wise, he had the exact same physical dimensions as the aforementioned Chavez. I dont remember Chavez fighting above 147, unless he did when he was shot against the likes of ODLH. Just because he fought at 154 before he fought Ray, doesnt mean he was suited at that weight. He just had no discipline and blew up between fights. He was simply never suited to be 154 and above. And as far as your he just fought better guys at 154 and above, just what fighter did he fight there was better than Leonard at 147?
     
  10. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Leonard did not fight Duran's fight in their 1st. People LOVE to make that excuse. He was known to fight pressure style and stand in the pocket as well as stick and move. It's the style that he utilized to stop Tommy as when he was "fighting his fight" as you claim, he was getting outboxed by Tommy. He had to pressure and slug Tommy otherwise he would have lost a decision.
     
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  11. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Duran was an ATG as a lightweight, a great fighter as a Welterweight and very good above Welterweight. Duran at weights above Lightweight had already had a long and very busy career and certainly was past his physical prime.
     
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  12. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Duran was very old school probably via Arcel. As one example You rarely see the parrying skills Duran had in today's fighters. Simply magnificent. I remember watching Duran fight the very dangerous Thompson and all fight Duran kept turning and parrying and countering until that huge hook in round 8 pretty much ended the evening for the challenger. This was an often overlooked but magnificent skillfull performance by Duran vs a very strong powerful challenger.
     
  13. tinman

    tinman Loyal Member Full Member

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    He beat Buchanan and Dejesus at 135. He also beat Leonard at 147. He also beat ATG Marcel at 130. So we can pretty much assume that at 135 he was the man.
     
  14. Reinhardt

    Reinhardt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Roberto Duran is the greatest lightweight who ever lived, that is the consensus opinion of boxing experts. Ali at heavyweight, Sugar Ray Robinson at welterweight are other consensus picks . Hardly any other divisions offer clear cut picks as these.
     
  15. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Whitaker would have outboxed him rather easily. I think Duran is overrated a bit. His resume does not show the best lightweight ever. The competition does not show a Whitaker or a Mayweather or an elite win. That is what Duran's career lacks. He has some good elite fights. Many. Hearns, Benitez,Hagler,Leonard etc etc, but he lacks elite wins.. And that is what we are looking for. Landing a right on Hearns or going 15 with Benitez or Hagler but losing all 3 is not atg ,and his lightweight reign lacks the resume some others had. Even Chavez. Where does the AT best come from?