Would you also say that Tyson was in his prime against Buster Douglas? Let me guess, you'd say that Douglas would beat Tyson any day of the week righ? Based on what? One fight Let me know when I can start playin the Guess Who's Laughing, cause that's what I'm getting at coming from you in this thread.[/quote] Someone's just a tad affected, no? I do think Douglas of Toyko beats more times than not any "peak" or better version of Tyson. For whatever it's worth.
I feel the same way... given how easily Foreman lost during his best days to skillfull, durable boxers in Ali and Young, and how he was nearly outslugged by the best, and really only puncher he faced - Lyle - it's hard to justify a really high ranking. The decisive losses to skilled boxers signify his lack of boxing skills. However, his destruction of Frazier and Norton are something to behold. Winning a Olympic gold and re-capturing the title against an, admittedly weak champion, but one in his prime, at 46 does count for a lot. But you have to take the good with the bad, and the bad is that he lost to mediocrities like Morrison, and Schulz, to a great fighter in Holyfield (no shame there) and arguably lost to Stewart and Savarese. Basically, his entire comeback career, outside of the Moorer win, consisted of great marketing and matchmaking, plus a few bogus decisions and ducking all dangerous guys. Yes, he was old, but it still counts against him. My biggest problem is that his best wins all came in perfect stylistic matchups - against boxers who weren't all that durable. Outside of that, his resume is razor thin. Still, those great wins put him in the lower part of the top10 for me.
Great article about Foreman, his power and how it compares to past greats who saw them all live ... http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/casey/MC_Foreman.htm
LoL, Jim Jeffries ranked 6th and ahead of Foreman. I'll read the article later. 7th is a fair spot, but I'm a bit turned off on some of the stuff written.
Yes, He was in his prime. But, being in one's prime, and willingly showing up to fight are two different things. At least I am placing the onus on Tyson for not being prepared, and not making excuses for him while still being in his 20's and the reigning champ. Let me answer that question by saying that it is one thing to turn the tables from losing a fight that went 10 rounds and even involved flooring your opponent once before losing, to changing the tides the next time around.. It is a different matter entirely, to lose a fight in a mere two rounds, mostly spent on your ass, and then hope for drastically better results the next time. For the record, Foreman destroyed Frazier twice. Tyson never got a chance to fight Buster again, given that he had basically disappeared off the face of the earth... If this is indeed a guessing game ( and I get the impression that it is ), the next time the issue of Foreman vs Frazier comes up, I'll take a stab at your respone, which will likely be... The first thing that anyone who knows anything about boxing will tell you, is that Frazier was washed up against Foreman.. Hence, the broken record pic....
What is so funny about Jim Jeffries in 6th. He beat every single top challenger of his time, and cleancleaned out his division, held the title for as long He held the title for 6 consecutive years before he retired as champion, which in history is Only bettered by John L Sullivan, Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey and Joe Louis. It was also equalled by Muhammed Ali. He was the first person ever to retire as undefeated Heavyweight champion of the world. A feat that to this day has only ever been duplicated by Rocky Marciano. Jeffries is still the only heavyweight champion ever who retired without ever having been knocked off his feet. In terms of height, by my count, he roughly rates comfortably in the top 10 heavyweight champions ever. In terms of weight, he is somewhere around the top 10, in terms of stamina he would easily rate in the top 5, in terms of chin he would rate top 5, heart he would rate in the top 5. In terms of speed there are conflicting reports, but i think that he is probably close to the top 10 or not far off it on most interpretations. With regards to number of victories against Hall of Famers, he would easily be in the top 5 of heavyweight champions. So, i ask the question what is so wrong about rating Jeffries 6th. I know there is a good argument to rank him higher, but there were a lot of great fighters (Foreman included) so i dont see why a 6th ranking is so funny, using any type of ranking system you want.
During 1973/74 Foreman was simply awesome. It just took an even more awesome fighter in '74 to beat him. Hardly anyone in boxing history could have picked him apart in Zaire like Ali did.
What I found interesting was the first hand accounts of trainers that saw Dempsey, louis and Foreman live and reviewed their power.
Interesting that no one mentioned that Frazier got the flu when he was beaten by Foreman. This content is protected
1. vitali klitschko 2. lennox lewis 3. wladimir klitschko 4. david tua 5. mike tyson 6. evander holyfield 7. rocky marciano 8. muhamad ali 9. chris byrd 10. joe louis quite fond of this list and the time it took me after reading this thread.
:rofl:rofl:rofl That is ****ing hilarious. I have Foreman loitering around the no.6 spot personally behind Ali, Louis, Marciano, Holmes and J.Johnson and in front of Lewis, Frazier, Dempsey and Liston.
