Is having Undisputed actually good for Boxing / fans?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by gollumsluvslave, May 13, 2021.


  1. gollumsluvslave

    gollumsluvslave Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I'm specifically thinking of the current negotiations between Fury and Joshua...

    One would have to assume that BOTH of them will want a rematch clause, and it then follows if they did rematch and it was 1 apiece there would be clamour for the rubber match, which would then be likely.

    This would effectively tie up all the belts between these 2 fighters for 18 months - 2 years conceivably, which then leaves mandatories like Usyk **** out of luck.

    There are WAY too many belts and variations, but i'm not sure I want to see Fury v Joshua for all the marbles for 2 years either. I guess at least one of the governing bodies wouldn't allow it for that length of time, so at least one belt might need vacated anyway.

    NB, I know that at one point AJ was going to have to vacate the WBO if he didn't fight Usyk, but assume the WBO have granted him a pass IF the Fury fight goes ahead.

    I'm a bit conflicted on this in that I love the idea of Undisputed - THE TOP DOG - in a division, but I'm not sure I like the idea of other boxers being frozen out for a long period of time either.

    Then again, on the flips side, trilogies of the top dogs has a rich history, so maybe the lesser talents should be fighting for scraps.
     
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  2. UltimateDestroyer

    UltimateDestroyer Member Full Member

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    In the ideal world you could have a trilogy with the fighters fighting someone else In between. This is how it should be.

    The problem is nowadays everyone waits/has to wait until they're nearly retired to start having their career defining fights.
     
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  3. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Yes, undisputed world championships should be the norm.
    The OP I think is objecting to "two fight deals" and "rematch clauses" and "tying up the titles" ..... yes, those things should not happen.
    There should be one fight for the undisputed title, and when it's done the loser should get back in the queue. The only exception being in the case of a very close and disputed decision or a draw, where an immediate rematch makes sense.
     
  4. gollumsluvslave

    gollumsluvslave Boxing Addict Full Member

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    This is why I really liked the idea of the original Super Six, with it's league format, even though it had a fair amount of flaws too

    Obviously they refined it in later years into straight knockout which I didn't like as much, but solved the issue of fighters withdrawing through injury (Kessler, Dirrel), but even then the appealing thing is:-

    1) The best fighting the best*
    2) A bit more variety than just the 2 cash cows going at it

    * Assuming that the participants are actually the best - Lucian Bute was a conspicuous absence in original Super 6, and again Jose Ramirez really should have been in the recent 140 tourney as well.
     
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  5. gollumsluvslave

    gollumsluvslave Boxing Addict Full Member

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    If the contract has a cast iron rematch clause, how would that work though? Let's say Fury wins a comfortable 116-112 type UD. Ordinarily there should be no rematch. But a watertight contract makes that tough.

    The governing bodies could of course make the champ vacate, but I don't like the idea of penalising the undisputed champ either!
     
  6. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Grandpappy Ortiz Full Member

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    Either a) There should be ONE undisputed fight, and then the winner fights the mandatories after and the loser gets back in line or

    B)The first fight should be for the undisputed, and if they want to have a 2nd fight that badly, they should forfeit some of the belts if you've got someone who's been a mandatory for a while like Usyk or Whyte. Usyk and Whyte should get a title fight against someone else high in the ranks.

    Usyk vs Joyce for the WBO.
    Whyte vs Wilder for the WBC.

    And then the winner of the 2nd fight of AJ vs Fury gets to go on and fight the winner of those fights to regain the undisputed mantle.
     
  7. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Grandpappy Ortiz Full Member

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    I also think they MUST fight the 2nd fight THIS year.

    They cannot wait another 6 months or else they should lose the belts, it's not fair to the mandatories.
     
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  8. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Rematch clauses should be elminated. They shouldn't exist ever.
    Immediate rematches should be discouraged. But in certain cases they make sense and the public demand them. There doesn't need to be a clause in the contract though.
     
  9. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Grandpappy Ortiz Full Member

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    I disagree with that personally, sometimes random fighters will KO a champ and then if there's no rematch will lose the belts to another another random.

    Champs can have rematch clauses, but they have to accept potentially losing one or two of their belts in the process if there's a mandatory waiting, and the rematch is too far away.
     
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  10. Benladdie3000

    Benladdie3000 Member banned Full Member

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    The amount of belts makes it so difficult to ever have an undisputed.
     
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  11. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Yeah, what's wrong with that ?
     
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  12. UmarIFLUmar

    UmarIFLUmar Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree with this. They should fight for all the belts and then they can vacate some the next day for all I care.
     
  13. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Grandpappy Ortiz Full Member

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    Some random fighter could get a lucky decision or a once in a lifetime KO, then without a champ rematch, the lucky chump could then get beaten by some other average fighter, and we'll have a bunch of chumps becoming undisputed time after time lol.

    I personally found it ridiculous how Whyte was allowed a rematch despite not being champion, but I think champions should be allowed a rematch to prove the first fight wasn't a fluke on the challengers part, and they've earned it in my opinion.
     
  14. tee_birch

    tee_birch Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Dont see anything wrong with it myself. IF...the contenders actually fight each other and just dont sit on mandatorys
     
  15. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Anyone who beat the champion should be regarded as champion, not just "some lucky chump"
    I can't think of a "lucky chump" who's won a title lately.
    If the decision is controversial, a rematch is bound to be demanded.

    All champions should fight the best available challengers. I'm certainly not advocating the best contenders being avoided.
    But champions who LOSE their title by clear-cut result should go back in the queue and have to fight another contender to get a shot at the title again.

    Otherwise we just get a situation where rematches dominate, and contenders get left on the shelf waiting for two-fight-series' and trilogies to end.