Is Hopkins the greatest fighter in terms of longevity?

I just gave my opinion on that

 

Dinosaur-huggers will be going "Well Archie Moore fought 4000 guys!" even if someone else wins a title at sixty. They'll be grousing all the while about how weak boxing is now, while pretending every random bum with forty losses their heroes fought was a legend.

Yeah gee, Hopkins is very careful in selecting which top contenders to beat up at age 48. Sorry, but this isn't even really an argument anymore. Hopkins is beating relevant dudes years past the age where Moore had fought a fat pro 'rassler and retired for good.

All hail the New Mongoose.

 

But as you point out Moore was fighting Ali (Clay), with nearly 1,500 rounds in his legs. Sure some of that was easy mileage, but Hopkins has less than 500 rounds to his name.

The truth is two top of range cars are of similar age, it is just one has done three times as many miles. Which suggests a more varied, interesting and greater boxing story...

 

it's **** all to do with opinions, just facts!

others fought longer and more, and against much more serious competition and every other week or month or so. say what ever you want, but that changes everything.

hopkins wouldn't have been doing it with such scheduals, none of the modern guys would have shared the same success with such scheduals... their records would look so different. some might never have even got to the top, others would have enjoyed a short ride and then eventually fall back. others would have been exposed earlier than they were, and all of them would have been trying do do it at a higher weight.

these facts change everything, opinions got **** all to do with it!

 

Ray did and was getting knocked down by Camacho jabs, it was the best thing I ever saw in a Leonard fight, made me almost like the Macho Man. So yeah I am all for talking up Leonard over 40. I just wish he had stayed on to fight Hopkins, Trinidad or Quartey, because I reckon a dirty look by Hopkins, would of scored a flash knockdown...

 

Maybe cherrypicking was the wrong word to convey what i feel about what he's done.My main stance is i think he's taken advantage of flawed overhyped fighters that have crawled to the top of a desolate weightclass, nothing wrong with it really especially considering his age, but when i watch him fight i haven't seen a bout worthy of especial praise since the calzaghe and Pavlik(who was himself a massive hypejob of only average ability, but i dug the way hopkins looked and fought there) ones.

Criticising Foreman? i can appreciate that too, but to me hacks like Dawson and Pascal are not any more notable than guys like Briggs, Schulz, Coetzer, Alex stewart, fat qawi, bert cooper etc You can say "ah but he's the recognised top light heavy" or whatever...that doesn't mean they can fight well.If hopkins fought someone who came out of nowhere and they looked very capable and yet he was able to beat them i'd give him his due no problem.

Bottom line i find little of value in Hopkins recent efforts...they are not good quality fights and he does not look a good fighter in them to me.I'm not even arguing he doesn't have some of the best longevity in the history of the sport...i'd actually agree there.

I'm simply saying i don't feel he'd have been able to do this in a stronger era to anywhere near the same extent and it's got nothing to do with bias against "the modern era".I'm interested in talent and good boxing, not dates.

 

Again, I think Hopkins is absolutely #1 in terms of defying age. He's had 60 or so fights though. By the time Moore was in his 40's he had hundreds and against much higher level of competition. Moore had to battle through more. His body went through much more wear and tear and he was old. His maintaining success after such a long, gruelling career is fairly absurd.

Fighters flame out after difficult fights and wars and so on. Their careers are cut short. Moore had his fair share of all that, was busy as hell, fought up and down from middle to heavy, and was still atop his division in his mid-40's. I love Hopkins, but for now, he's still 2nd place here.

 

Yeah boy, Pascal and Cloud are no Giulio Rinaldi. Titan of the ring he was.

 

Even the Calzaghe fight was pretty low grade from both men. Calzaghe looked old and faded and had nothing but hustle to overcome Hopkins, while Bernard made Joe look bad but offered little from an offensive standpoint that was quality.

As far as the current light heavyweights go, we are indeed amidst a horrible era.

Someone as bad as David Telesco would probably do well amidst the current crop.

 

that goes without saying, we know that. but as to who would do what in what era it can only go one way!

Moore & Co have already PROVED what they are and would do just fine in a Lesser World, but we can't say the same in the reverse. IF Bhop & Co had to do it in a Greater World, it's very accurate to say their "record" and Weight Division would be SO different, we can't say they'd have the same success, we just can't!

they'd be fighting a whole new level of skill & greatness that they never had to face and at a weight division higher (at least), than they can get away with in this modern world.

as I said those lads are already proven as to what they can do, the other way is a whole different set of circumstances and outcomes!

 

I've nothing new to add directly to the argument about Hopkins, but going off on a slight tangent concerning miles on the clock rather as well as numerical age, I think Griffith was quite remarkable. Since 1959, he'd been fighting and mostly beating - at a quicker rate - opponents of a standard generally much superior to that of Hopkins' opponents when he travelled to Germany aged 38 as a late replacement for Ray Seales to perhaps controversially miss out on nicking the light middle title from the talented Dagge. Hopkins was a similar age, though slightly older, when he lost his titles to Taylor.

Tbh, I don't think Griffith was hugely removed from Hopkins' standard when they were both in their very late 30's in spite of the fact that he was still going to every corner of the globe to various opposing backyards around 5 times a year having previously put together one of boxing's great CV's over about 18 years.

He was similar in a physical and tactical sense too in the way he kept himself in immaculate shape and crossed what strong fundamental skills he had with unedifying spoiling old man type trickery/grappling to compensate for his age.