Is it abnormal to rate Arguello above Whitaker?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by IvyLeagueBoxing, Aug 17, 2013.


  1. IvyLeagueBoxing

    IvyLeagueBoxing Well-Known Member Full Member

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  2. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Alexis did it over the championship distance. Not Pernell's fault, but it is what it is. The end of round 12 was the final bell for Whitaker in title bouts.

    Several times, Arguello competed in the championship rounds. He lost to Marcel over that limit, dethroned the great Olivares in 13, stopped Escalera twice in that round, decisioned Leon and Watt over the championship distance, halted Mancini in 14, and got stopped himself by Pryor in the 14th the first time they squared off [after landing some magnificent rights in the 13th].

    Harry Wills absolved Dempsey of guilt for never defending against him, but the fact still remains it never happened. WW II froze the likes of Burley forever out of the title picture. And the abolition of the championship distance denied us the chance to ever find out just how good the boxers who came afterwards really were.
     
  3. thistle1

    thistle1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Rate whomever you want over anybody as long as it is sound investigation...

    titles & achievements does not the greatest necessarily make!!!
     
  4. timmers612

    timmers612 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Achievements in boxing does not make up who is great? What else in a boxers record does?
     
  5. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'm going to postulate that he's referring to titles, which in the case of Burley, Wills, etc., is a pretty sound argument.
     
  6. thistle1

    thistle1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :good and dozens more!
     
  7. timmers612

    timmers612 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ok, I get what you meant now and totally agree.
     
  8. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    A matter of opinion ... I think Pernell decisions him but a tough fight ...
     
  9. Ipay4leavingNot

    Ipay4leavingNot Active Member Full Member

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  10. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I can C de rizen 4 duing so
     
  11. KuRuPT

    KuRuPT Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes there is clearly something wrong rating him above Whitaker
     
  12. 88Chris05

    88Chris05 Active Member Full Member

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    Two of my all-time favourites, but I cannae have Alexis higher than Pea.

    Alexis is the kind of fighter I'd have on the cusp of my all-time top 20, pound for pound, but Pernell would be on the cusp of my top 10.

    Nothing on Arguello's record can really compare to Whitaker shutting out a genuine all-time great in Nelson or dominating an even greater fighter in Chavez. I think Whitaker showed that he could be truly masterful (as opposed to just very good) across the weights; if you take his best wins / performances, they're nicely spread across 135 (Haugen, Nelson), 140 (Pineda), and 147 (Chavez, McGirt II, De la Hoya). Hell, even at 154 he was good enough to navigate a champion certainly more proven than current-day Canelo without too much trouble!

    On the other hand, Alexis was absolutely sensational at Super-Feather, but not quite the same either side of it. The loss to Marcel (no shame in that, of course) at Featherweight, as well as struggling so badly with a shopworn, undersized Olivares, and then at Lightweight he dropped a decision in a non-title fight to Fernandez (could just have been a lack of focus, in fairness, but we'll never know), let Watt off the hook when he had him hurt (which wasn't like Alexis at all) and struggled a bit with Mancini in an admittedly excellent fight.

    In essence, Pea was just at that amazing kind of level for longer than Arguello was, and I think Whitaker beat the better names in his career, too.