Is Jack Dempsey the most overrated fighter of all time

Agreed.

Let's say that Anthony Joshua understood himself to be fighting some non entity, and he was told at the last moment, that he was actually fighting a name fighter, who was well past their prime.

He would be on very reasonable grounds refusing.

Fighting a significant opponent, requires a training camp, to match the opponent.

 

Fair enough, though I got the impression somewhere that Robinson was notorious for pulling out of a whole bunch of fights, and sometimes for some pretty questionable reasons/excuses.

 

Calling Joe Jeanette an "absolute killer" in 1918 is ridiculous. Jeanette was 39 years old and hadnt won a significant fight in years. Nobody was asking anything of Dempsey that anyone else on that card wasnt willing to do. Benny Valger was an up and coming prospect who faced the best black lightweight in the world, Leo Johnson, on that same exhibition card, Eddie Wallace faced Willie Jackson, Johnny Dundee fought Joe Welling, Frankie Burns fought Young Jack Sharkey, Soldier Bartfield fought Jack Britton. Everybody on that card had a much more competetive match than Dempsey would have had had he fought Joe Jeanette and certainly harder than Joe Bonds who was originally scheduled to face Dempsey. The lengths people go to try to avoid the warts and all truth about Dempsey is pathetic. And for the record Dempsey wasnt champion when this took place. It was 8 months before he won the title. He was a contender. Nothing more. He had absolutely nothing to lose by facing the completely geriatric Jeanette in an exhibition bout.

 

There are several problems with this way of thinking but first and foremost Dempsey wasnt a champion when this took place. It took place 8 months before he became a champion. He was nothing more than a contender but feel free to move the goal post again in your pursuit of your version of the truth.

 

I figured that was coming. We tend to give our darlings special treatment dont we? Its a good thing the war effort had real fighters who were willing to donate their services against other real fighters to give the fans competitive matches. If the card had been populated by preening protected media creations like Dempsey there wouldnt have been any fights or any money gathered for the war effort and everyone would have booed back to their dressing rooms like Dempsey did.

 

If you knew what I was going to post I doubt you would have based your argument around a fallacy about a champion being matched against an absolute killer for an exhibition bout that nobody else would have been expected to do when in reality a contender was being matched with a toothless balding old man while everyone else on the card was being matched very tough, often with men who had fought real bouts with them on even terms. But you knew that didnt you? Which of course gets to motivation.

 

It was an exhibition Matt. It wasnt a real fight. He wasnt going to lose the title you imagined he had because he didnt have a title. Indeed he wasnt going to lose anything at all. The mere fact that he feared he might get made to look bad says quite a lot about him whether you agree or not. As I said, you can move the goal posts all you want: First a champion shouldnt be surprised by a change of opponent, now ANYONE, shouldnt be surprised by a change of opponent. At a charity event. For an exhibition. With no decision rendered. When every single fighter on the card was matched far tougher than Dempsey for the sake of the audience who were paying to see good exhibition bouts to support the war effort. The idea that Dempsey had anything at all to lose in facing Jeanette in an exhibition at that point in Jeanette's career speaks volumes about Dempsey. You may not think thats important but plenty of people do (as has been covered before) and did back then. Hence him being booed back to his dressing room. Hence it providing fodder for the press for weeks afterwards. Hence all of the black fighters jumping up to support Jeanette. Given Dempsey's continued refusal to meet his most threatening opponent for years despite the wide support that opponent had this instance is very important to Dempsey's story. You can read it however you like but the way you initially framed it was a joke from top to bottom:

"I can't imagine, as a professional champion,"
Dempsey wasnt a champion

" it's considered good form to be asked to turn up and fight a soft touch for a few quid for some charity,"
It wasnt a fight, it was an exhibition.

"get in the ring, and there's an absolute killer with an axe to grind stalking the opposite corner."
Jeanette wasnt anywhere near an absolute killer in 1918.

""Past prime" or no."
Yes, you knew even as you typed what you were saying was ridiculous hence your wish to have it both ways with your air quotes of "past prime" as if that was just something people said and Jeanette wasnt past his prime. Of course he was past his prime. Badly. And the idea that Dempsey was above facing a faded warhorse who was no longer a serious contender even in an exhibition bout for charity because he was afraid a surprise was being sprung on him is troubling if you really want to believe this narrative of Dempsey being this rip roaring two fisted man of iron.

 

I hope all Scottish egos arent as fragile as yours. LOL. My advice would be that the next time you post about a subject, read about it first. Dont get all of your information from the message boards you live on. Most of these people are a lot like you, just regurgitating things theyve read in this echo chamber. That way you dont get caught making it up as you go along.