Is Joe Calzaghe an ATG?

The funny thing is when Joe ruled the division, there is a certain German man who was also undefeated and held the WBA/IBF title. Perhaps it's the only time in history two undefeated champion in the same division, both got a claim to the lineal title, refuse to face each other.

 

You're talking about Ottke? Yes, he had a great record too. If you take out the glossy (but past their best) names of Jones and Hopkins, Ottke's resume in not much below Calzaghe's in my opinion. Of course, Ottke couldn't break an egg but was a skilled boxer.

 

It is not easy to go 46-0 and he fought some good fighters, what people forget is that for his last 2 fights Joe was over 35 and had to move up, out of his natural division

 

Yes, Calzaghe and Ottke spent 6 years as SMW champion and neither are too thrilled to face each other. An unique case in boxing. At least Ottke KTFO'd loud-mouthed Anthony Mundine, though.

 

Except Joe offered to face Ottke for 1 Euro and Ottke refused.

 

Is that for real ?

 

Yup, Ottke never wanted a piece of Joe, Joe hunted him for years and made a living beating (and usually stopping) fighters that had gone to Germany and were robbed by Ottke.

There is a lot of revisionist history about Calzaghe's career, but the reality is he had been seen as the #1 fighter at 168 ever since he beat Reid, Starie, Woodhall, Veit and Mitchell within the space of three years. He was basically for a time there fighting whoever had faced Ottke and had either a close decision or a robbery and beating them easily.

Then he beat Lacy and became a megastar.

 

I'd be more inclined to put Calzaghe as an all-time very, very good rather than great. Just doesn't have the wins on his record to make him a certainty, for me, and was too happy to stay on the periphery of his division fighting second-raters for too long. A fighter who showed such a chronic lack of ambition and who wasted so many of his prime years fighting the Staries, Pudwills, Salems and McIntyres of this world, when there were so many better fights in and around him being given a pass to true greatness would be a bit of an insult to some of the legitimate greats, I feel. Greatness should be reserved for the truly remarkable, and if you find Calzaghe's resume remarkable then I think you're a little easily pleased.

Shame, as he had plenty of talent as he displayed and his late career surge from 2006 to 2008 hinted at what could have been. But he just left it a little too late in my opinion.

 

a very good fighter sure, but JC and his S-MW friends are really L-HWs like Conn and in order to size them up historically they have to be compared with 'proper' L-HWs like Conn, Moore, Johnson and so on...

here you can place the Bhops, RJJ's and JC's of recent years more honestly in historical terms.

 

Ottke's blatant robberies over Robin Reid, Brewer and Glen Johnson are the reason why ppl think you just can't win a decision in Germany. Maybe that's why RJJ refused to fight Dariusz M in Germany, he got robbed on foreign soil once before.

 

What kind of idiotic, ignorant argument is that? The SMW division was only created 30 years ago ffs so I could hardly match Calzaghe up against a long list of SMW's.atsch

Calzaghe spent years killing himself to make SMW. He said himself numerous times that he struggled to make the weight and would be more comfortable at LH, but he stayed where he was, fighting low level opposition because he didn't fancy his chances at LHW.

Joe himself knew his limitations, just a shame his deluded, ignorant fans don't.

 

His performance against Lacy was great.

 

Not even close.

Joe won a few rounds clear off a last second weight cutting tired Eubank and most of the second half against the uncomplicated Kessler. That's it. That's his career.

All I could think of while watching him from a modest distance away at the Thomas & Mack is "this is not a particularly talented athlete .. his striking is abysmal .. his lateral movement and quickness is unexceptional .. he has no head movement, or familiarity with an opponent feinting and switching up their timing or cadence, no ability to avoid walking into shots, and he is very fortunate to be seven years younger than this version of old Bernard Hopkins".

 

I didn't think he won the Hopkins fight necessarily.
Didn't see him land a real punch all night.

I can't argue with the Lacy domination though.
Lacy was just a hype job perhaps, but even so, it takes some ability to dominate any sort of contender or title-holder like that.

 

The Lacy win was good, but a lot of people on here are referencing it to validate Calzaghe's ATG status, which seems ludicrous. Lacy was very strong, but his defense was very poor, and he really possessed little boxing ability. He basically walked forward in a straight line and looked to power punch. Granted, Calzaghe had the fortune to be the first to expose Lacy, but a lot of guys could have done it.