Is Joe Frazier a fraud?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by round15, Nov 2, 2011.


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  1. round15

    round15 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    What's the general opinion of everyone on this forum?

    Goyourownway is one of few posters I've read who strongly believes Frazier was a protected fraud that would have never been a heavyweight champion or had any sort of significant career in boxing if Ali wasn't exiled.

    I believe he would have given Ali all kinds of problems at any time in their career s. The FOTC, if happened in late 68 or 69 would have been a fantastic fight as well. Maybe Ali wins this one because of his speed and reflexes. It's not unreasonable to believe he would have had better legs at this time in his career.

    I also believe that Frazier thought nothing of George Foreman as a serious contender, evidenced by Ken Norton getting the better of him in the sparring sessions and Futch's concerns that Jamaica was a big party and not a training camp.

    thoughts,
     
    round15, Nov 2, 2011
    round15, Nov 2, 2011
    #1
  2. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Goyourownway is a fraud.
     
    El Bujia, Nov 2, 2011
    El Bujia, Nov 2, 2011
    #2
  3. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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    Goyourownway is likely a troll though. So, either it's not his genuine opinion or he's simply a massive bell-end. No need to address his point of view from either front.
     
    Boxed Ears, Nov 2, 2011
    Boxed Ears, Nov 2, 2011
    #3
  4. Goyourownway

    Goyourownway Insanity enthusiast Full Member

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    There's a difference between believing somebody is overrated and believing that they're a complete fraud.As far as I know,I don't recall ever referring to him as such.


    Me referring to him as being "protected" is in reference to his and his teams avoiding of punchers.And considering my criticisms are rarely anything to do with Ali,there was really no point in bringing him up.



    The excuse that Frazier thought nothing of Foreman as a contender is just a silly one.The only reason Frazier fought him was because he was forced into doing so.Frazier even pointed out that the fight didn't last long enough(for his supposed lack of shape) for it to be a determining factor.
     
    Goyourownway, Nov 2, 2011
    Goyourownway, Nov 2, 2011
    #4
  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I wouldn't waste time on this troll.

    But just to spark a debate on the topic:

    Prime for prime, frazier beats ali.
     
    lufcrazy, Nov 2, 2011
    lufcrazy, Nov 2, 2011
    #5
  6. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think few fighters are as respected as Frazier here. There will always be detratctors, but Frazier doesn't have many.
     
    Bokaj, Nov 2, 2011
    Bokaj, Nov 2, 2011
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  7. Pachilles

    Pachilles Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He's done nothing to deserve any detractors.

    Like Holyfield and Morales, the man is a straight up Spartan who defines everything which is good in the sport of boxing.
     
    Pachilles, Nov 2, 2011
    Pachilles, Nov 2, 2011
    #7
  8. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Pffft, yeah I bet you like Nickelback, too. Those of us in the know realise that Matthew Saad Muhammad is where it's at.
     
    El Bujia, Nov 2, 2011
    El Bujia, Nov 2, 2011
    #8
  9. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    Joe will forever be the real deal.
     
    robert ungurean, Nov 2, 2011
    robert ungurean, Nov 2, 2011
    #9
  10. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    From 68-73 he cleaned house in dominant fashion. One of the division's greatest fighters fo sho!
     
    lufcrazy, Nov 2, 2011
    lufcrazy, Nov 2, 2011
    #10
  11. PetethePrince

    PetethePrince Slick & Redheaded Full Member

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    Umm... hipster?
     
    PetethePrince, Nov 2, 2011
    PetethePrince, Nov 2, 2011
    #11
  12. round15

    round15 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Why is it silly? I've watched more than a couple interviews with Eddie Futch, before he was training Riddick Bowe and during the time he was Bowe's chief cornerman, discussing Frazier's downfall in Jamaica.

    Practically everyone in Frazier's camp, Futch to a lessor degree, believed Foreman was a strong young kid that wouldn't be a problem. Futch believed Frazier's ability and experience would be too much for George. If you read the book "Cornermen," Great Boxing Trainers, by Ronald K. Fried, there's a whole section on Futch and what he thought of Frazier's title defense against Foreman. Futch had serious fears when he arrived later in the camp and saw all the partying going on. His fears were that much greater after watching Norton get the better of Frazier in the sparring sessions, which is why he called it off.

    Bottom line, Frazier didn't think much of Foreman as a contender and if you looked at who George fought up to the 73 challenge of Frazier, there's nothing on his resume that was immediately impressive. Foremans greatest wins start at his win over Frazier. With the exception of Chuvalo and Peralta, who else stands out? Nobody. This is one of the reasons why Frazier grossly underestimated Foreman.
     
    round15, Nov 2, 2011
    round15, Nov 2, 2011
    #12
  13. carlosg815

    carlosg815 Member Full Member

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    Joe Frazier is one of the greatest fighters to ever set foot in a boxing ring.
     
    carlosg815, Nov 2, 2011
    carlosg815, Nov 2, 2011
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  14. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I don't understand the thread .. was he a protected fraud, no way ...did he under rate Foreman and self destruct in Jamaica , yes.
     
    he grant, Nov 2, 2011
    he grant, Nov 2, 2011
    #14
  15. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yeah, taking PEDs is everything which is good about boxing. :thumbsup


    Joe Frazier is a legend and so is Morales though.
     
    bodhi, Nov 3, 2011
    bodhi, Nov 3, 2011
    #15
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