is lennox lewis one of the greats?

Everytime I hear this I want to at least point out Lewis' version of events, which is that he hurt his right hand to the point of barely being able to use it for a couple of rounds during the fight.

 

:goodExactly. A fair, honest and balanced opinion. Something you hardly see on here.
No doubt Wlad turned his career around after those shocking losses, and thats what there were, shocking! He deserves all the credit he gets for that. But no way has he been tested in the same manner Lewis did, or come through the fights he did. Simply because his competition just isn't on the same level and never will be.

 

That is a poor statement. Personal preference i know, but you can't really believe that.

Numbers don't tell the story mate. Lewis was pretty much fast tracked and fought at the highest level for most of his career.
Yes Wlad has fought at the top for most of his career too, but most of his first 40 fights were pure cannon fodder.

 

Ok what about losing to Sanders and Brewster the wu he did. He was more than an established fighter and I would say that's worse than gassing out

 

This is apples and oranges. People were calling Lyle one of the great punchers of his or any era. Mason is a big puncher, as was Lyle, but I'm not labeling him amongst the greatest in any list. Tua, Morrison and Tyson, however, have all time power, arguably harder hitters than anyone Jack Johnson, Dempsey or Louis ever faced.

I hate to hammer the obvious, but bigger fighters tend to punch harder, not always and in each case, but as a trend. This is one of the reasons we have weight divisions. The 90's fighters focussed on power in their performance. Perhaps to the detriment of their pace and stamina, but they could punch. I am open to hear an argument of which era had harder punchers than this.

 

That's how I see it

 

Well, I followed the heavyweight scene throughout the 1990s, and the way some of those fighters get rated now is incredible. Guys like Mercer, Morrison, McCall, Bruno, Mason etc. were not that much better than the guys Wladimir has been fighting.

I agree. But it's still a good record from Wlad - considering he's been fighting at least one contender a year for the last 10 or 11 years.

 

Sure, but for what it's worth he came back to beat Brewster (like Lewis did with McCall), and Sanders was at least a fast hard puncher. Most importantly, he has improved since then. I wouldn't write off those defeats at all, but it seems a very similar scenario to the Lewis one.
I rate him a bit below Lewis, who I don't rate as high as most here anyway.

 

It's different flaw that's far worse than Lewis' was. Wlad falls apart when he gets hit hard and thats been the course of his entire career. Revenging a loss against a fighter he should have beaten doesn't erase the facts and Wlad has shown four times he's not tough when the going gets rough and it's been against fairly bad limited fighters really.

 

Comparing heavyweight credentials and saying fighters were "nowhere near the top of their game" are two different things. To you if a fighter has 1 loss he isn't near the top of his game. Its ridiculous.

The only person I call a liar is you. I've always been a fan of Bowe and would have picked him to win if he and Lennox had fought. But the bottom line is he ducked Lewis. Like him or not these are facts.

It seems a bit funny you would say the guy who was directly accused then and now of ducking Lewis, for trashing his totle, wouldn't be biased about his own career decisions.

 

Seriously I don't see much of a case to argue against.
You're going say Rahman or Mason was a better puncher than Schmeling or Walcott or Moore or whoever, and Morrison was an "all-time" puncher ..... and they are more likely to "spark you out" ...... without much reference to actual results , and just as much emphasis on size, strength etc.
It's not much of an argument, IMO.
Yes, Lewis beat some big strong steroid-assisted type men.

Of course, I wouldn''t like to get hit by a Mason or a Rahman anyway !

 

Bowe won the fights but he didn't beat anything in either fight. I doubt there are to many more fights in history where a fighter git his ass kicked as thoroughly as Bowe did and still ended up with the W.

 

He's got off the deck to win fights.
I'm not sure Lewis was much better in keeping composed under heavy attack or coming back from being badly hurt either.
I must have missed all that.

 

But like you have just stated yourself they were better!
Fair enough, but like i said numbers don't mean nothing. Just look at the level of competion.

 

Yeah you must of. I think it's clear as day. Lewis was hit from making an offensive and defensive mistake. Wlad was hit and looked like a drowning man because the opponent simply rushed him. I don't think it rreally has anything to do with getting off the deck. It his inability to handle pressure. Noone has really tried to use that against him lately because they don't know how.