Is LNP really fighting?

lay and pray sucks, but the judges are to blame.

being on top doesn't mean you're winning, but the old senile *******s are too lazy to learn that simple concept.

more than one submission attempts from the bottom overides four minutes of being on top and ineffective punches.

 

Nope but according to the UFC its scoring

 

GSP - ATG @ LnP

 

Is a boxer controlling a match off the backfoot by using quickness and footwork really fighting?

At the end of the day if you're able to stop somebody hitting you either by holding them down or by staying out of reach you're doing more than they are. If they want to defeat you they have to step up either sweep you/block the initial takedown or trap you by cutting off the ring.

 

Its the same argument - what's more important position vs. damage? The cliche is that the key to any fight is to hit without being hit. Lay and pray just like boxing at a distance off the backfoot allows a fighter to do that.

 

Wrong exemple.
A boxer who is fighting at a distance from the backfoot is still boxing, he keep jabbing keep throwing punch.

L'n'P( at least for me, MY definition of L'n'P) is when 2 guy's seems to have same ground skill(or one of them is superior) but the same dude doesn't have a good stand up game. So in the UFC(or any unified rule) the only thing that guy as to do is bring you down and lay on you. If he manage to do some transition and get a dominant position, in my eyes it's no longer L'n'P, the guy is actually doing something but if the only thing he is doing is laying on top of you without and can't pull a transition, not even trying to subb you of throw some kind of punch or elbow, then you arn't doing **** and even though you are on top you are ****in doing nothing.

Best exemple is King Mo VS Moussassi
That was a painful 25 minute, King Mo doing some takedown, getting them bu he couldn't switch to a dominant position while Moussassi just destroyed his face from the bottom...I understand why King Mo got the decision, but I think it was the wrong one and the only reason why he won is because of the stupid rules !

 

Yes, because he would still be landing shots. Boxing is more a match than a fight.. This is even one of the arguments of MMA. You can control a boxing match by fighting more defensively, but you cant win a fight by just making a guy miss.. You need to land shots yourself..

This isn't the case in MMA. You can be clearly, and cleanly out struck, but you can win a, "fight" on a scorecard by dominating the grappling alone. You don't have to land a single shot, or go for a single submission.

 

If somebody is literally holding you down, not only stopping you getting up or going for submission attempts or throw strikes off the back then they are legitmately dominating. Even if they all do that while staying in half guard, you can critcise them for not being more adventurous but you can't score the fight against them.

Now the fight in question, yeah there was an argument that Moussassi deserved the nod due to ground striking. If I remember rightly he really only started taking most of the fight with strikes off his back when Mo tired in the championship rounds. But yeah the principle is sound, if somebody has space to do damage off his back then the guy on top has not properly established Octagon control.

 

Its MMA. If the telling difference in the match was grappling then what's the problem with the better grappler getting the nod?

 

I agree with you, but do you agree that if 1 fighter is focusing on prohibiting is opponent of either striking subbing or changing position, he isn't doing any damage he is not improving is position and he is not looking for a subb. I understand your point that if the guy is dominating on the ground should win but I honestly think there is a clear difference between a dominating someone on the ground (GSP) and trying not to get either subb or KTFO by holding your oppnonent on the ground and doing nothing(King Mo VS Moussassi)!

Alot of people consider GSP L'n'P, I agree more or less...at least GSP is trying to go for a subb from time to time but if there is something nobody can argu is that GSP is DOMINATING on the ground.