Is Lomachenko an all-time great ?

I am a huge Loma fan, I rate him to be one of the most skiller boxers ever, certainly top 5-10, he would have beaten anybody 130 and under in my opinion.
The only question mark around his resume is the Teo loss which imo was a draw but the fight left a sour taste as Loma basically threw away the fight in the first half and woke up in rd 7, Teo didn't do ****, he landed 6 punches per round from rd 1-6 but it was enough to win the rounds as Loma didn't even punch for the first 6 rounds.

 

He had been hyped till heaven because he is from US not from Ukraine.

While Spence Jr is huge boxer for weight class he is competing.

I judge boxers equally regardless from their origin, I think there not less than 50% posters does have deep problems with this.
Posters here hide their biased point of view cos they fear to admit that boxer's origin matters damn a lot for them.

Pre injury Spence Jr I think was prime Spence.
I judge all fighters equally.
In good shape Spence Jr I think will beat today's Lopez, Loma and ofc Rigo too.
He is 147lbs division boxer, Crawford does not fight with him even after his serious injuries in car accident.

 

100% no for the pros. The amateurs, clearly, yes. I haven't seen greatness in the ring from him in pro boxing. Close, and the athleticism is all-time great as a standalone trait. But it's just one thing. He showed me he could beat Salido. He showed me he could beat Teo. But he didn't, even though he was showing he could, in the same fight. In between, I thought we'd never see that after Salido. Not that he wouldn't lose but that he wouldn't lose that way. But then it did. That is decidedly not great. Duran, for instance, had his scandalous low. Okay. But he did enough before that and after that to prove what he was overall. Lomachenko has only really showed that he'd be very good in any era. He doesn't even have as a pro what Rigo had against Donaire. What happened there is in some ways like if Loma schooled Crawford. I know there are plenty of differences there but that's as close as I could come to making the point. I can't really look at him and think "What a great fighter." I look at him and think "What a great athlete." But I had similar feelings about Wladimir until his body of work was just too much to not call him great.

 

Of course you did not had ever even assumed that he might be top 10 level boxer in ANY division. Because his origin.

He was great vs Russel Jr and Campbell and do not post here that Campbell is nobody, he is Olympic Gold medalist and I'm sure that he is able to punch head harder than Haney is capable at 140 lbs, not alone this Loma.
You might post about Campbell that he is not a champ in pros and wasn't.
What from this?
He managed to drop Garcia who is huge lad for 135 lbs division for sure and puny for 135 lbs division small Loma he did not had managed to drop for a count.

This is reality and when you will post how bad Campbell is, Garcia dropped him with a liver punch, like Loma did vs Linares.
I suspect that this might be reaon for you to call them as chinny boxers?

Well, ATG usually for US values number of belts etc.
Cos he had 1 belt at 126 lbs and 1 belt at 130 lbs and bunch with belts and The Ring belt only at 135 lbs then for ATG for sure does not looks enough if we base this on merit in pro ranks, belts in multiple weight classes.

Btw in amateur ranks there are only 3 boxers who had 3 Olympic Gold medals. Loma had 2.
Small pool with boxers with 2 Olympic Gold medals, there a lot of Cuban boxers.

Yeah, if amateurs had HOF, then Loma already was there.

 

Yes he is an ATG, he has ATG skills and talent, everyone who says otherwise DKSAB.

 

ATG's will be remembered. If Loma never fights again, will he be remembered after his fanbase is all gone from the earth? Will he be remembered like Joe louis, Dempsey, Marciano? Damn good fighter, he just turned pro 4 years too late.

 

If he does that, Teo will just raise his demands even further. The point of Teo's demands isn't to win more for the fight, the point is not fight in the first place.
Teo knows that he's gonna lose a rematch against Lomachenko, so why he would do that? For him, beating Kambosos now and then move to 140 to face Taylor for the undisputed light-welterweight championship of the world makes way more sense.

Lomachenko isn't getting any fights at 135, not against the key names in the division. If he eventually makes his way to mandatory position, they will simple move to 140, where they are too big for Loma to try.

Lomachenko career is done if he stays at 135.

 

Loma is nowhere near an ATG and don't rate the hall of fame yet. Maybe the amateur hall of fame. He only has sixteen professional fights and he lost two of them. He has excellent skills but a lot of fighters have great skills. It is about the totality of his professional career which is lacking.

 

He is an ATG and he also beat Teo

 

Why maybe?
Number of boxers with 2 Olympic Gold medals + 2 World Championship Gold medals is small. They compete everywhere these fights are done and fight with any one they had been given to fight + in tournament format where fights are in row with small time interval.

Loma and Rigo for sure had been in amateur HOF if Olympic rules boxing had HOF.

If we use highest achievements in Olympic Games as criteria for ATG in Olympic rules boxing there most likely are only 3! ATG boxers in Olympic boxing.
Most Olympic gold medals in Boxing | Guinness World Records

 

This.

 

Is Lomachenko an all-time great ?

Potentially. Like a couple of the other fellas I say he's not done yet and maybe even after he is done needs some years of perspective to understand the context in which his accomplishments (or lack thereof) ought to be judged.

 

He ties the record with Saensak Maungsurin for winning a world title in the fewest professional fights, winning the WBO featherweight title in his third fight. All of his professional fights except the debut were world championship fights. He made his first main event in the second professional fight.

This record will most likely never be broken. Lomachenko will be remembered after he’s long gone and his career isn’t even over.

Until there exists a criteria list to call someone an ATG, this debate will not have a definitive answer.

 

Huge miscalculation on Loma for not scripting in a rematch clause. Huge miscaculation thinking he could beat a bigger, stronger and younger fighter with 1 arm. He only has himself to blame for where his career sits now.

 

Yes, I agree with you. Lopez had 1 belt and Loma 3? belts etc. And Lopez was not mandatory like Usyk is for A.J. Lopez had belt in org where Loma did not had belt or was mandatory for this belt.
If Loma was under Oscar or especially if under Eddie, there had been clause per se or no fight cos not mandatory even if this had get till purse bids, Loma still was able to insert a rematch clause because Lopez was not his mandatory as far as I had get.

Lopez will feel this when he will step up to 140 lbs and 147 lbs with even more harsh glance.
He will get lost fight via stoppage in distance here sooner or later and also lost fights on points if he will continue to box when he will be 32-33 y.o.
I btw think that Ward is more smart to retire in time here.