Is Manny Pacquiao Fighting Errol Spence The Most G Move In Boxing History...???

And what is your point? State the obvious? LWs also have smaller frames, smaller necks, smaller skulls, it’s all relative, if their heads are getting bounced around for 12 rounds, they’re taking damage.

It’s a fact that the HWs have better longevity in terms of age. Joshua started boxing in his 20s. No one who is at LW would be able to do that.

Becoming a HW champ at 40 is so common it’s not even a big deal anymore.

Answer this, why are there so many old HW champs and so few Lighter weight champs if HWs have a harder time aging?

Foreman - 45
Vitaly - 42
Lewis - 39
Wlad 39
Walcott 39
Holyfield 38/39
Fitz 37
Ali 38

meanwhile the oldest WW champ ever is Pac at 40 and the 2nd is 38/39.

 

First of all, Pacquiao was literally starving when he was at flyweight, and Duran didn't start at SFW, he made his debut a pound over the BW limit. This was when both were teenagers.... hardly their prime weights.

When they reached their peaks, they were about the same size. Pacquiao peaked between 130 and 140 in the day before weigh-in era, whereas Duran was between 135 and 147 in the same day weigh-in era. On fight night, they both often weighed in the low-mid 140s, and this was a trend in Pacquiao's career all the way up from fighting at 122. He's the same size as Duran, no matter what weight they turned pro at. Pacquiao was a smaller teen, but they were they same size as men. Furthermore, Duran spent nearly ten years at or around lightweight, there's no argument that it's not his natural weight.

The reason why Pac's fights with his Fab 4 were at 130/126 is because the other three were featherweights.

Athletes age differently. Duran's prime ended at 29 years old, when he ballooned up and quit vs Leonard. He was never the same after, and this is very obvious on film. Whereas Pacquiao's ended at 33 when he was KOed by Marquez. Furthermore, Duran suffered an even worse KO years later at the hands of a much more deadly fighter, who was much bigger, at a weight he didn't belong at. The fact that Duran was three years younger than Pacquiao was for Thurman is made up for by the fact that Duran's career was much more difficult than Pacquiao's and he had much more wear and tear.

The fact that Pacquiao was still regarded as one of the best welterweights in the world going into the Thurman fight testifies to that he wasn't quite as diminished by then.

The oldest middleweight champion is Hopkins at 40, not 49. He lost to Taylor when he was 40 years old. At the time Duran beat Barkley, the oldest middleweight champion ever was (to the best of my knowledge, at any rate) Dick Tiger, at 36. For Pacquiao, the record was Jack Britton, again at 36 years old. That's not a world of difference, mate.

So I don't understand why you're putting so much emphasis on the weight it happened at. It wouldn't be as significant as you're making out, even if Duran was a natural middleweight. As it stands, he isn't a natural middleweight, and so it's even more impressive because he was both older, had worn himself out at more vitiating weights and the much, much smaller man.

And you must not have been paying much attention, because everyone knows Canelo waited for GGG to age, and everyone called him out on it at the time, before and after.

You also have to appreciate the good 20lbs difference between Thurman and Barkley on fight night.

 

While in peak condition, they weigh the same, so they're the same size.

Anything else is wrong.

 

No, it's because Duran had a better chin than the three of them

"Pacquiao is a LW"
"Manny Pacquiao and Roberto Duran are not the same size."

Which is it?

 

Duran was fat as **** at 168, and literally middle-aged

If you're using that as evidence as to why he's bigger than Pacquiao, despite already saying that Pacquiao is a natural lightweight - like Duran - then you've just admitted they're the same size. If you wanna try and mental gymnastic your way around that, go for it. You're still wrong.

 

Canelo was accused of waiting for GGG to age, but this accusation backfired on GGG fans, as they eventually ended up seeing their fears play out in front of them. Canelo played his cards perfectly, he dropped the MW belt which he had won vs Cotto at a catchweight and this action gave GGG and his fans a false sense of security. It also was the right thing to do because this gave Canelo the opportunity to win the belt properly at the full MW limit instead of at a catchweight. Once GGG was handed the belt, GGG fans proceeded to over play their hand thinking GGG getting the belt indicated Canelo was scared of fighting GGG, so this caused GGG fans to start talking all kinds of ish about what GGG would do to Canelo if they fought.

The fight was only put on hold for about 1 year from when the fans wanted to see it to when it ended up happening. Compare that to Mayweather and Pacquiao, which was put on hold for about 5 or 6 years and Mayweather was making all kinds of excuses to avoid that fight.

But you're right that everyone and their mother called Canelo out for supposedly ducking GGG for a year and vacating the belt, only to fight him the next year as a challenger, but it only made the fight that much bigger when it happened. And I still fail to see how a fighter could know how quickly his opponent would age and slow down. Anyway you slice it, it was a tactical success for Canelo to wait a year to fight GGG, if GGG did slow down during that year then that exposes a serious lack of work ethic and motivation from GGG or his team to stay in the gym and maintain his prime into his mid 30s, as other fighters have. This has been said before, but GGG fans have been exposed as having a victim mentality and an entitlement complex as it pertains to Canelo and how everything went down.

I mean, here we are talking about how Pacquiao at 41 years old, 5-6 years older than GGG was when he fought Canelo after the whole 1 year of waiting for Canelo to fight him, to which caused GGG to go from prime to being a senior citizen. Pacquiao who turned back the clock against Thurman at 41 years old and showed he hadn't lost a step. But GGG had already lost a step by 34/35?

Now granted, Pacquiao went through a funk in his mid 30s, too, he got KTFO by Marquez and looked slow and lethargic against Mayweather, but then he obviously re-dedicated himself after that and ended up looking better in his late 30s early 40s than he did in his mid 30s. But GGG, he apparently let himself get out of shape between the ages of 33 and 35 when he well out of his prime, according to his fans.

Maybe if GGG had the work ethic of Pacquiao to maintain his speed into his late 30s, he wouldn't have slowed down in that year that he had to wait to fight Canelo. Maybe Canelo's waiting a year to fight GGG exposed GGG, and maybe it made all the difference. And if that's the case, then Canelo and his team were brilliant in how they played that. But again, how can any fighter predict the exact timeframe that a fighter will slow down? Some fighters fall out of their prime by age 30, other fighters fight well into their mid 30s without slowing down. (Froch for example) So how did Canelo's team know that GGG at 33/34 was just one year away from becoming old overnight? Doesn't that expose a flaw to GGG, that maybe he didn't stay in the gym as much as he should of while he was waiting for the Canelo fight?

A lot of boxing is mental, we seen how Pacquiao ended up being an injured, poor version of himself when he fought Floyd. But then Pacquiao went on to become a better version of himself years later. It seemed that GGG knew that GGG was starting to decline, and Canelo was taking advantage of that by giving him the MW belt and making GGG wait. He gave GGG what he wanted, "give me my belt" remember. Well he got his belt, and then Canelo challenged GGG for that belt and won it back. It was a brilliant tactical move to make GGG wait that year, to know that GGG was in decline. To forsee that weakness from GGG. We talk about how boxers target an opponent's weakness. Like Mayweather when he fought Pacquiao he targetted that injured shoulder. Canelo is just a master of psychological warfare I guess huh.

 

Right he declined after getting KTFO. For maybe 1 or 2 years. Maybe even up till he fought Jeff Horn, maybe he was still fighting too cautious. But then what happened, then years after the Marquez KO, Pacquiao started to incline, right?

I mean by the time Pacquiao fought Matthysse, this was like a rejuvenated Pac-Man again, right. When he fought Broner, that was Pacquiao at his best, that was a way better Pacquiao than the Pacquiao who fought Mayweather or the Pacquiao who struggled with Horn. So Pacquiao after being KTFO, declined, then a few years later, miraculously got his mojo back and suddenly inclined. Right? I mean after getting KTFO it's natural to become more cautious for a few fights. And that's when Mayweather pounced on him, when he was still shaking off the cobwebs from that KO. Pacquiao at his best was never cautious, and I think it took him a couple of years to shake out the cobwebs of that knockout loss. But since that Matthysse fight, we have seen a rejuventated Pacquiao, a better version of Pacquiao than he was between 2015-2017. Despite being much older and pushing 40, he looked better than he looked years earlier in his mid 30s.

 

Not even close, watch those fights back to back. Pac looked bad vs Broner. He looked bad against Thurman. There were times there where should have pulled the trigger but couldn’t. He was tripping over himself on the Broner fight. Thurman attacked Manny on the ropes and Pac couldn’t really make him pay the way he did Cotto. Pac was just always 2-3 levels above these guys, even in decline, he still wins.

Think about it, would Thurman have beaten Margo, Cotto, Mosley, Clottey? Pac dominated all those guys, washed them. Meanwhile he edged an SD vs Thurman. If he was still that same Pac, he would have washed Thurman in a similar fashion.

Both Pac and Floyd was far and away from their completion at their time. It was Floyd and Pac and then the rest. The rest wasn’t even competitive with them. Nowadays, nobody has really set themselves apart like they did, it’s all a close race, we’re still looking for that Usain Bolt to pull away.

Pac vs Floyd still looked sharp, he countered Floyd twice clean and had Floyd on the ropes. Floyd just had a good game plan, tied him up close and poke him from a distance. It was a lot closer fight than people say it was, I have Pac 4 rounds and so did the judges, and the rounds Floyd won were won by a couple of jabs, no dominant rounds.

The last time Pac was at his peak was JMM 4. He was messing a roided to the gills JMM up until that perfect counter.

 

Except for Canelo, you mean. Canelo is more of a clear P4P #1 now than either Mayweather or Pacquiao ever were.

 

Is he though? A lot of people think Crawford is better than him and not long ago, Loma was considered to be better. Some think Inoue is better than Canelo p4p and if Crawford is contender for p4p 1 but is 50/50 with Spence, then so is Spence.

None of these guys have really separated themselves from each other.

GGG was Canelos ultimate test, the only A level fighter on his list. If he was a true A+ fighter, he would have beaten him convincingly.

Canelo vs Ward, would Canelo even be the favourite in that fight? Today’s p4p 1 won’t even be the favourite against yesterday’s p4p 3.

Pac/Floyd was atop the p4p rankings for a decade. It wasn’t even close.